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Antivaccine nonsense Medicine Politics Quackery

RFK Jr. as HHS Secretary will be a catastrophe for public health and medical research

President-Elect Donald Trump has nominated antivax activist, conspiracy theorist, and all around crank Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to be Secretary of Health and Human Services. We are so screwed.

It figures.

Remember about a month and a half ago, when I described why this blog, which had been known for rather prolific and prodigious content over nearly 20 years—no, seriously, my 20th blogging anniversary is in less than a month—had become nearly fallow? The reason, you might recall, is the declining health of my parents, both of whom are in their mid-80s and both of whose health is simultaneously declining? You might also remember that I thought the situation had stabilized and that I could get back to something resembling a normal blogging schedule? That lasted less than a week, and since this post on DMSO over two weeks ago, this blog has been silent, which is probably an unprecedented amount of time to go without a new post over the last two decades. Without going into detail, let’s just say that my father had another health crisis and hospitalization. He’s in rehab now; so things are again stabilizing. (I hope.)

And then, late yesterday afternoon, I learned that, as I had feared, speculated, and predicted, Donald Trump had nominated Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. for Secretary of Health and Human Services. Yes, I had started speculating that that’s the job that RFK Jr. was angling for when he suspended his campaign and bent the knee to Donald Trump nearly three months ago, but even as I was predicting it I wasn’t quite sure that I believed that Trump would go through with it, if only because of discussions I had had with a reporter and others who said that many thought RFK Jr. would be “unconfirmable.” My retort, although not my 100% certain retort, was: Are you sure about that? Are you really sure, given the current state of the Republican Party? I’m not, nor was I at the time.

In any case, if there’s anything that could motivate me to get back in the blogging game, it has to be something like this. After all, I’ve been writing about RFK Jr.’s antivax stylings and conspiracy mongering since June 17, 2005. If ever there was a time to get back to my old ways, it’s now. So, regardless of my personal family challenges, I’m going to try to do just that. I’m also going to start out by calling out reporters for sanewashing RFK Jr., just as Jonathan has. I experienced one example of this just this morning on the way to work. While flipping channels, I came across NPR’s Morning Edition, which in a story about the nomination kept referring to RFK Jr. as a “vaccine skeptic,” although the story as published on the website has the less offensive title Trump picks RFK Jr. to oversee the Department of Health and Human Services. However, if you listen to the report, which is nearly four minutes long, you will hear the term “vaccine skeptic” applied to RFK Jr. several times:

Let’s just say that, every time I heard the term “vaccine skeptic” used, I cringed. No, I literally cringed. It wasn’t just NPR, either, which pulled a masterpiece of “bothsides” reporting in which the reporter counters RFK Jr.’s stated claim that vaccine science is inadequate and vaccines are unsafe with, basically, a pathetic, “Experts disagree.” The venerable BBC is guilty too (Trump picks vaccine sceptic RFK Jr for health secretary). So are STAT News (Trump taps RFK Jr. to run HHS, nominating vaccine skeptic for nation’s top health role), The Washington Post (Trump taps Robert F. Kennedy Jr., vaccine skeptic, to lead HHS), and the New York Times (Trump Picks R.F.K. Jr. to Be Head of Health and Human Services Dept., which has the tag line, “Whether the Senate would confirm Robert F. Kennedy Jr., a vaccine skeptic who has unorthodox views about medicine, is an open question.”) I might have to write yet another post about this soon (maybe as soon as my Monday post at my not-so-super-secret other blog), but my message to reporters is this: Stop it! Just stop it! RFK Jr. is not a “vaccine skeptic.” He is antivaccine. That I still have to keep saying this now, two decades after RFK Jr. Be more like NBC News and the AP (Trump picks RFK Jr., anti-vaccine activist, for health and human services secretary and Trump chooses anti-vaccine activist Robert F. Kennedy Jr. as health secretary, respectively), at least on this. Stop sanewashing RFK Jr.

And don’t get me started on reporters referring to Kennedy’s views on health as “unorthodox” or “outside the mainstream.”

Let’s take a look at what worries me about RFK Jr. being in charge of HHS.

Prelude: A shift in the political center of gravity of antivax and quackery

I’ve said many times that I strive to be nonpartisan but make no promises to be apolitical. After all, promoting science-based medicine is not just a scientific and medical endeavor; it is also a political endeavor, given that the federal government regulates and funds healthcare, drug approval, and national public health programs, while state governments regulate the practice of medicine, as well determining vaccine requirements for school and a number of other medicine- and public health-related requirements and local governments have their own laws and regulations. Indeed, that is why I liked Jann Bellamy’s posts at a certain other blog about “legislative alchemy” designed to provide the imprimatur of the state on pseudoscientific and quack medical practices and specialties and, before the pandemic, I used to write regularly about efforts to weaken or eliminate school vaccine mandates and the “right-to-try” movement, which was custom-designed to weaken the power of the Food and Drug Administration.

I will admit, however, that it’s become increasingly difficult to remain totally nonpartisan, given the events of the last decade, but, even more, events since the pandemic hit nearly five years ago. While there are still crunchy lefties promoting various woo, including alternative medicine, antivaccinationism, unwarranted fear mongering about pesticides and “chemicals” in food, and false beliefs that, for instance, cell phone radiation causes cancer, by and large it’s difficult not to accept in the face of overwhelming evidence that the ideological center of gravity in terms of hostility to science-based medicine and science-based health policy has shifted far to the right. I’ve described how it’s a process that I first started noticing 10-15 years ago, as more and more antivaxxers started promoting conservative and right-leaning candidates; accelerated beginning in 2015, when opposition to California law SB 277, which eliminated nonmedical exemptions to school vaccine mandates galvanized the antivaccine movement to successfully use the rhetoric of “freedom” and opposition to government overreach to attract conservatives; infested the Republican Party during the 2016 Presidential primaries and the 2018 midterms; and became (if you’ll excuse the term) turbocharged after the pandemic, when opposition to non pharmaceutical public health interventions like masking or school and business closures, vaccine mandates, and basically any non-voluntary public health interventions resulted in the fusion of the antivaccine movement with right wing resistance to what it saw as “tyranny.”

As I’ve written about and the Conspirituality Podcast has documented over the last five years or so, basically a lot of the New Age “spirituality” and quackery, including the antivaccine movement, has shifted far to the right, to the point that we see lots of pseudoscience and conspiracy theorists who used to be perceived as being on the left now fully MAGA and aligned with Donald Trump. Whether this is because the grift is better there or because of a genuine ideological shift or both, it’s happened, and I still haven’t decided what the biggest factor was fueling this shift.

RFK Jr and Donald Trump: MAHA?
RFK Jr and Donald Trump.

One such example is Robert F. Kennedy Jr. When I first started writing about RFK Jr. nearly two decades ago, he had just “come out” as an antivaxxer, publishing his deceptive conspiracy-fest of an article Deadly Immunity in Salon.com and Rolling Stone promoting a conspiracy theory falsely claiming that the mercury-containing preservative thimerosal, which had been used in many childhood vaccines until around 2001-2, was responsible for an “epidemic” of autism that the CDC was covering up. (My deconstruction of the article was my first blog post ever to go viral.) It might be hard for our younger readers to recall that, when RFK Jr. first launched his antivax crusade in 2015, he explicitly linked it to his previous environmentalist activism fighting pollution and mercury contaminating water supplies. It was just the start of many years of demonizing vaccines and promoting antivaccine pseudoscience and conspiracy theories. Although I could see signs of this in him before the pandemic, the pandemic led RFK Jr. to embracing far right movements. As you probably know, in 2023 RFK Jr. announced that he was running for President. However, by August, he suspended his campaign and embraced Donald Trump, who promised him a major role in his administration overseeing health policy. By September, RFK Jr. had coined the term “Make America Healthy Again” (MAHA), an obvious homage to Donald Trump’s longstanding slogan “Make America Great Again” (MAGA), although in his MAHA manifesto he hid his antivax proclivities, which his antivax followers did notice and were dismayed.

They shouldn’t have been. It should always have been clear to anyone that, if RFK Jr. were ever to be put in charge of the federal health apparatus, either as Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS) or in some “czar” role, it would be an extinction-level threat to science-based federal health policy, which would be replaced with pseudoscience, quackery, and conspiracy theories. When I first wrote about RFK Jr.’s antivax conspiracy-fest of an article two decades ago, never in my worst nightmares did I envision that he might be on the cusp of being put in charge of the nation’s healthcare policy, regulatory, and research apparatus. Now he’s been nominated. While there is still some slight hope that the Senate might have just enough of a modicum of sanity left not to confirm RFK Jr., I have little confidence that they won’t. (I don’t even have confidence that they won’t confirm Matt Gaetz, even though conservatives are making crude jokes about his penchant for young girls; e.g., Barbara Comstock, who responded to a joke by George Conway that Gaetz “couldn’t make it here tonight because he had a hot date” by chiming in, “It’s called a recess appointment.)

Donald Trump: Letting RFK Jr. “go wild” on health?

Not long ago, I wrote about what the “health freedom” movement and its takeover of the Republican Party in terms of anything having to do with medicine and public health might mean after I had come across a post by RFK Jr. on X, the hellsite formerly known as Twitter, saying that he would “declare war on The FDA”:

The full version of what this might entail can be found here; the CliffsNotes version follows. Basically, it would mean the dismantling of a regulatory and public health apparatus built up over decades that, while flawed, has mostly successfully improved the health of Americans and protected them from unsafe medications and foods. No one, least of all I, is saying that the system couldn’t use significant improvement, possibly even major reform, but that’s not what RFK Jr. is about. What he is about is tearing the system down.

Donald Trump addressing the crowd at Madison Square Garden.

The night before that post went live, Donald Trump held what was basically a fascist rally at Madison Square Garden that made the news because of the racist comments of some of his surrogates. Less reported was something that Donald Trump promised his followers:

And we also have somebody that is great. And look, we’re not going to let him go too crazy, Elon, with the oil and gas stuff. Because Robert F. Kennedy cares more about human beings and health and the environment than anybody. And he’s going to be absolute. Having him is such a great honor. I’ve been friends of his for a long time. And I’m going to let him go wild on health. I’m going to let him go wild on the food. I’m going to let him go wild on medicine. The only thing I don’t think I’m going to let him even get near is the liquid gold that we have under our feet. I don’t know, Elon. He might not like liquid gold. It’s oil and gas. Sometimes referred to as oil and gas. J. D. , I think we’re going to have to keep him away from the oil and gas. What do you think, Howard? Yes?

But where is Robert? He’s around. He gave a beautiful speech. And it’s an honor.

I must admit that one consolation in all this, as minor as it is, is that I do find it rather amusing that RFK Jr. willingly signed on to be part of a campaign in which Trump explicitly states that he can’t address the environment—you know, where his roots were—if it interferes with the profits of the fossil fuel industry. Given that so much of public health is related to the environment, that is a rather large no-fly zone for RFK Jr. I suppose, in his lust for power, he considers it an acceptable price to pay, but who knows? Be that as it may, what do “go wild on health” and “go wild on medicine” mean in this context?

When I originally started writing about RFK Jr.’s having joined Team Trump, I feared that he would want to be HHS Secretary, because the Department of Health and Human Services oversees the vast majority of the federal health and medical apparatus, including Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services (which oversees the massive Medicare and Medicaid programs), the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the Food and Drug Administration, the National Institutes of Health, and more. I started to wonder if that were true, based on a recent news report in The Washington Post suggesting that he would be more of a “health czar”:

Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is poised to have significant control over health and food safety in a potential Trump administration, with discussions about some Cabinet and agency officials reporting to him, according to four people familiar with the planning process who spoke on the condition of anonymity to detail private conversations.

Kennedy has been privately meeting with Trump transition officials to help draw up an agenda for a new administration, which could involve the longtime anti-vaccine activist taking a role as a White House czar rather than attempting to win Senate confirmation to lead an agency, the people said. Kennedy and his advisers have also been drafting 30-, 60- and 90-day plans for what they would like to accomplish after Trump is inaugurated, according to one person familiar with the planning process.

“The president has asked me to clean up corruption and conflicts at the agencies and to end the chronic disease epidemic,” Kennedy said in an interview Wednesday. “He wants measurable results in two years and to return those agencies to their long traditions of gold-standard evidence-based science and medicine.”

And:

Kennedy told his own supporters in a Zoom call Monday that Trump has promised him “control of the public health agencies,” singling out the Department of Health and Human Services and its subagencies, and also naming the Department of Agriculture. The agencies are collectively responsible for implementing food and public health regulations; approving vaccines, medications and health-care devices; enforcing safety measures in food-processing facilities; steering billions of dollars in federal research initiatives; and overseeing Medicare, Medicaid and the Affordable Care Act, among many other responsibilities.

“Long traditions of gold standard evidence-based science and medicine”? Anyone who’s paid attention to RFK Jr. over the years knows that RFK Jr. is pretty much the opposite of evidence-based science and medicine. He has been spreading antivaccine misinformation, disinformation, and conspiracy theories for close to 20 years now, and, more recently, has increasingly entered the “wellness” grift side of things. To envision him in charge of so much of the health policy, science, and research apparatus of the federal government should truly terrify you. Certainly it terrifies me. Now we know that Trump has rewarded him with the nomination for HHS.

Since the election, RFK Jr. has been suggesting picks for key posts who are in line with his “thinking,” such as it is. The list will include some names that should be familiar to our readers:

Kennedy has been working to identify possible personnel for a future Trump administration, a list that Trump advisers say includes Casey and Calley Means, siblings and health-care entrepreneurs who have become close advisers to Kennedy; Marty Makary, a Johns Hopkins University physician who advised the Trump White House on health-care price transparency; and former Trump health officials such as former Centers for Disease Control and Prevention director Robert Redfield and former Department of Health and Human Services spokesman Michael Caputo.

The Means siblings, Makary, Redfield and Caputo have been working with Kennedy to roll out his “Make America Healthy Again” (MAHA) platform, an initiative to tackle chronic disease and childhood illnesses — and a deliberate riff on Trump’s “Make America Great Again” (MAGA) slogan. None of them responded to questions about their potential roles in a future Trump administration, with several declining to comment.

Dr. Martin “Marty” Makary was, before he became a COVID-19 contrarian who has appeared frequently on right wing media outlets minimizing the pandemic and advocating a “Great Barrington Declaration”-style “let ‘er rip” approach to the pandemic claiming that “we’ll have herd immunity any day now” while fear mongering about the vaccines, first made a name for himself publishing some of the most risibly bad science I’ve ever seen. Sadly, that awful science, which claimed that medical errors are the third leading cause of death in the US (they aren’t—far from it), “stuck,” to the point that it’s become a commonly cited (and totally erroneous) factoid that even people who should know better sometimes casually cite when discussing the shortcomings of our medical system. Basically, like RFK Jr.’s resistance to vaccines, the viewpoint promoted by Makary and his allies has devastated public health—and didn’t work. Truly, given that Dr. Makary is, like me, a surgical oncologist, whenever I discuss him I feel like Sylvester Jr. in the old Looney Tunes cartoons, putting a paper bag over my head in extreme embarrassment and shame due to his father.

“For shame.”

Casey and Calley Means, of course, I have discussed before. They’re a brother-sister team. Calley is an “entrepreneur” who runs a business based on attracting federal health savings funds to purchase alternative medicine treatments. His sister Dr. Casey Means is a physician who trained to become an otolaryngologist, but dropped out of her residency in her final year. (Who does that, so close to the finish line?) In any case, her company promotes “metabolic health” as the answer to all diseases. From my perspective, they are simply health grifters who have seized upon the shift of the political center of gravity of the wellness movement in order to latch themselves onto Donald Trump and make money selling their wares to (mostly) the right. As for Dr. Redfield, he started out semi-reasonable (and provaccine) when he served as CDC Director during the Trump Administration, but has of late gone further and further down the MAGA conspirituality rabbit hole, promoting doubt about COVID-19 vaccines and, of course, lab leak conspiracy theories. Finally, back in 2020, Michael Caputo, who at the time was Assistant Secretary of Public Affairs at HHS, publicly stated some bizarre conspiracy theories, such as accusing the “Centers for Disease Control and Prevention of harboring a ‘resistance unit’ determined to undermine President Trump, even if that opposition bolsters the Covid-19 death toll,” led “efforts to warp C.D.C. weekly bulletins to fit Mr. Trump’s pandemic narrative,” promoted disinformation about COVID-19 vaccines, and is perhaps best known for having written an email in which he stated that “we want them infected” in order to pursue “natural herd immunity.”

It’s quite a motley crew, a rogues’ gallery of COVID-19 antivax disinformation. But what would they do?

A dagger aimed at federal health policy and public health

So now we know a bit about the proposed role for RFK Jr and about some of the characters he might bring in to run HHS, the FDA, the CDC, the NIH, and CMS, but what would it mean? One indication came in the form of a post like this:

…which were discussed in stories like this one:

As president, Mr. Trump would not have the power to order states and municipalities to remove fluoride from their water supplies; fluoridation is a matter of local control.

But a presidential pronouncement would inject the White House into a debate that stretches back to the 1950s, when conspiracy theories swirled around fluoridation, with critics claiming it was a Communist plot to poison Americans’ brains — a view that was memorably parodied in Stanley Kubrick’s film “Dr. Strangelove.”

I like that the reporter mentioned one of my favorite movies of all time, and, really, we know 60 years ago, when this movie was released, that this anti-fluoride fear mongering of the kind that RFK Jr. is now resurrecting was a conspiracy theory not based in evidence. Fluoride is safe and has been one of the most effective public health interventions ever. Again, states determine whether to fluoridate their water and what concentration to use, but a federal official recommending against it would likely lead to states whose current governments are aligned with the MAGA movement deciding to stop fluoridating their water, likely with predictably bad outcomes in terms of dental health of their populations, especially children.

Unfortunately, unlike regular readers of this blog, there are a lot of people who don’t know a lot about RFK Jr., haven’t paid attention to his antivax activism, and were maybe even reassured by his intentionally not mentioning vaccines in his MAHA manifesto, even if his own followers weren’t and were dismayed. Remember, in 2019, a mere three months before a pandemic was declared by the World Health Organization, RFK Jr. directly contributed to vaccine fear mongering in Samoa even as a measles epidemic that would claim the lives of over 80 children was raging. Before that he used to routinely compare vaccines and the vaccination program to the Holocaust. That is, of course, why his followers were so disappointed when he first published his MAHA manifesto that left out any mention of vaccines. If you were in any way reassured by that, you shouldn’t be.

One thing I’ve been wondering, though. If RFK Jr. is not confirmed, who might be the second choice? RFK Jr. could just be a head-fake. Trump might have nominated him just to say that he kept his end of the deal, neither knowing nor caring much if RFK Jr. were actually ever confirmed. If RFK Jr. were to fail to be confirmed, given what a shitshow the nomination hearing will be given the 20 years of ammunition RFK Jr. has provided for Democrats, who might step in?

I have…ideas:

Florida’s top health official, whose tenure has been marked by his warnings against vaccines, threats to TV stations for running abortion ads and frequent clashes with public health experts, has emerged as a candidate to run the Department of Health and Human Services in a potential Trump administration, according to two people familiar with the process.

Joseph A. Ladapo is on a list of HHS secretary candidates being assembled by Robert F. Kennedy Jr., who has been charged with helping select staff for the nation’s health and food agencies if Donald Trumpwins office, according to the people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe the planning process. HHS is responsible for overseeing Medicare, Medicaid and the Affordable Care Act; approving vaccines, medications and health-care devices; coordinating responses to disease outbreaks; and numerous other priorities across its nearly $2 trillion budget.

Ladapo, who has served as Florida’s surgeon general since 2021, has repeatedly defied public health practices — such as failing to urge parents to vaccinate their children or keep unvaccinated students home from school during a recent measles outbreak — drawing scorn from public health experts who say his decisions have imperiled Florida residents.

I’ve been writing about how bad Dr. Joseph Ladapo has been regarding vaccines going back a few years. You might remember that Ladapo first came to prominence during the early days of the COVID-19 pandemic as a founding member of America’s Frontline Doctors, which made a name for itself in that horrible first summer of the pandemic by touting hydroxychloroquine as a miracle cure for COVID-19 and later turned to telehealth grift selling prescriptions for ivermectin to cure COVID-19, and a signatory of the Great Barrington Declaration, the document published by contrarian scientists brought together by a right-wing think tank to advocate a social Darwinist “let ‘er rip” approach to the pandemic with poorly defined “focused protection” for those most at risk for severe disease and death from the pandemic. In 2021, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis appointed Ladapo Surgeon General, a position that put him in charge of the Florida Department of Health, where he proceeded to do everything in his power to impede public health responses to the COVID-19 pandemic and to spread fear and uncertainty about COVID-19 vaccines, even if he had to cook the numbers and lie with statistics to do it. In the meantime, he continued to promote COVID misinformation, even going so far as to refuse to recommend COVID-19 vaccines to almost anyone this year, the first time, as far as I’m aware, that a state government health department failed to recommend an FDA-approved and CDC-recommended vaccine against anything. I feared and speculated that Ladapo might score a high ranking federal position related to health policy if Donald Trump were elected. Ladapo is, after all, one of the golden docs in the MAGA antivax movement. Now, if Trump wins, that fear is likely to become reality:

The prospect of a vaccine skeptic such as Ladapo in a national health role has alarmed public health experts, pointing to his decision to warn Florida residents against the mRNA coronavirus vaccines while citing debunked claims. No other state public health officer has followed his lead.

Even if RFK Jr. is confirmed as HHS Secretary, look for Ladapo to be considered for positions like CDC Director or FDA Commissioner. Or maybe he will be Deputy Secretary of HHS, given that that role serves as the COO of HHS and oversees all operations within the Department, including overseeing Medicare, Medicaid, public health, medical research, food and drug safety, welfare, child and family services, disease prevention, Indian health, and mental health services under the leadership of the HHS Secretary.

Then there are the others. One of the names that I keep seeing popping up to be FDA Commissioner is Dr. Martin Makary, although sometimes I see his name popping up to lead the CDC. Makary is a well-published surgical oncologist at Johns Hopkins, which is why I frequently joke (as a fellow surgical oncologist) about needing to put a paper bag over my head when I see some of his pronouncements. You probably recall that we at SBM don’t think much of Makary, who first came to my attention as one of the foremost promoters of the myth that medical errors constitute the third leading cause of death in the US, all based on a risibly incompetent study that used unjustifiable extrapolation from small numbers to conclude that 250,000 deaths occur each year in hospitals due to medical error. As I pointed out at the time, whenever you see an estimate of how many deaths are “deaths by medicine,” it’s very helpful to compare that estimate with what we know to assess its plausibility. According to the CDC in 2016, of the 2.6 million deaths that were occurring every year in the U.S., 715,000 occurred in hospitals, which meant that, if Makary’s estimates were correct, 35% of all hospital deaths were due to medical errors. But the plausibility of Makary’s estimate was worse than that. Remember that the upper estimate used by Makary and Daniels was 400,000 inpatient deaths due to medical error. That was 56%—yes, 56%—of all inpatient deaths. It was never anywhere near plausible that one-third to over one-half of all inpatient deaths in the US were (or are) due to medical error.

Then there’s Dr. Jay Bhattacharya, co-author in 2020 of the Great Barrington Declaration, which advocated a “let ‘er rip” approach to the pandemic, with “focused protection” of those at highest risk for severe disease and death, in order to achieve “natural herd immunity,” while not spelling out what, exactly, was meant by “focused protection.” It’s an approach that never would have worked and whose advocates devastated (and continue to devastate) public health. What position is his name popping up for? CDC Director, of course.

I could go on, but I’m getting depressed, because the situation could end up being worse than you think, as was reported right before the election:

A co-chair of Donald Trump’s transition team said Trump supporter Robert F. Kennedy Jr. wants access to federal health data so he can show vaccines are unsafe and lead to them being pulled from the market in a second Trump administration.

Howard Lutnick echoed a number of Kennedy’s debunked anti-vaccine talking points in a CNN interview Wednesday, including falsehoods about the vaccine schedule and the disproven theory that vaccines cause autism. Trump has talked often about how Kennedy, who suspended his own presidential bid and endorsed him in August, will have a big role to play if the former president returns to the White House.

While Lutnick said Kennedy would not be chosen as secretary of health and human services, he was not specific about what Kennedy’s role might be. Lutnick made the comments the same day that Kennedy told NewsNation that Trump asked him to “reorganize” agencies including the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the National Institutes of Health, the Food and Drug Administration and some agencies under the Department of Agriculture.

If you’ve read this blog and/or my not-so-secret other blog, you know that antivaxxers use data from vaccine safety databases the same way that a drunk uses a light pole: For support, not illumination. Just look at Steve Kirsch and his increasingly ridiculous torturing of any data that he can get his hands on, all designed not to determine if vaccines are safe, but rather to prove, by any means necessary, including torturing the data, that vaccines are dangerous and ineffective. You can be sure that, should RFK Jr. gain access to federal vaccine and medication safety databases, what will follow will be a tsunami of poor quality and misleading studies designed to demonstrate that vaccines cause autism, childhood chronic health problems, and all manner of health issues, and that they don’t work. Count on it. That’s what his antivax org Children’s Health Defense has done for years. Why would it be any different if RFK Jr. gains power over the massive federal health apparatus. Trump’s own co-chair for his transition team has told you what RFK Jr. wants to do. He wants to “prove” that vaccines are unsafe, as a prelude to taking all of them off the market:

Lutnick, the CEO of the financial services company Cantor Fitzgerald, told CNN that Kennedy wants access to data “so he can say these things are unsafe” and that will stop the sales.

“He says, if you give me the data, all I want is the data and I’ll take on the data and show that it’s not safe. And then if you pull the product liability, the companies will yank these vaccines right off of the market. So that’s his point,” Lutnick said.

It was unclear what data Lutnick was referring to since extensive data and research on vaccine safety is publicly available.

Seriously, the title of an article published the a couple of weeks ago by NBC News is not an exaggeration: Trump team fully embraces RFK Jr.’s vaccine skepticism. (One more time, I hate it when editors and journalists describe his antivax conspiracy theories that way.) More appropriate is this headline for an article published over the weekend in The Intelligencer, a section of New York Magazine, Trump Transition Chair Blurts Out Plan to End All Vaccines: Kook Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to steer Trump public health:

In the interview, Lutnick calmly repeated a series of vaccine-skeptic talking points. He did not even limit his vaccine skepticism to the COVID-19 vaccine, which is safe and effective, but to all vaccines, which he painted as unregulated, dangerous, and part of a for-profit conspiracy between the pharmaceutical industry and the federal government. The steps he proposed would be to give Kennedy data about vaccines, and if Kennedy decides they are not safe, which he already has, the FDA could pull approval.

Exactly. RFK Jr. finally has the opportunity to realize his longtime dream of eliminating vaccines from the market. Sure, he denies that that’s what he wants and claims that he’s “not antivaccine” or, even more risibly, that he’s “fiercely provaccine,” even though his history demonstrates that he is neither.

And:

The federal government plays an essential role in authorizing vaccines and pharmaceuticals. It is true that the government’s scientific authority is not omniscient, and there are enough cases in which scientific authorities have imposed political judgment in place of evidence to raise ample grounds for treating any of their pronouncements with some skepticism.

But justified skepticism is one thing. Subjecting public-health decisions to RFK Jr.’s cracked worldview is something else altogether. And the process Lutnick proposed to Collins — that the FDA could withdraw approval for a suite of life-saving vaccines because Kennedy decides the data is insufficient — is a glimpse into a public-health nightmare.

It’s more than just vaccines and fluoride, though. With RFK Jr. as HHS Secretary, the entire federal public health establishment could be reorganized and recast, to the detriment of public health everywhere:

Project 2025 describes the C.D.C. as “perhaps the most incompetent and arrogant agency in the federal government,” and calls for it to be divided into two entities.

One would be responsible only for publishing data gathered from states and other sources. The other would retain a “severely confined ability to make policy recommendations” under the auspices of political leaders.

“He’ll go down the path that he started, which is to fully politicize the C.D.C.,” said Lawrence Gostin, the director of the W.H.O. Collaborating Center on Global Health Law, referring to a second Trump administration.

Exactly. The article mentions that a lot of this would require Congressional approval and that “moderate Republicans” might balk at going so far, but there is a widespread belief in the GOP that the CDC has “gone too far,” which has led to a desire to “pare it back” to stop it from investigating or intervening in legitimate public health issues whose findings are not in line with MAGA politics, such as gun violence and the like.

Worst of all, however, RFK Jr. would have huge influence over the CDC. A number of pundits and apologists have been trying to reassure the public that it isn’t that bad, that what RFK Jr. can actually do is fairly limited given that much of the current construction of HHS and the agencies that make it up is defined by statute and would require an act of Congress to change too dramatically. True enough, but that doesn’t mean that RFK Jr., through the appointment of his buddies, couldn’t do enormous damage anyway. Let’s look at one example, the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP). This is the committee that advises the CDC on vaccination policy and which vaccines to include on the childhood and adult schedules, which is why it has long been a target of ire for antivaxxers. In August, Dr. Paul Offit wrote about what sort of mischief that could be done to ACIP by antivaxxers in a Trump administration, although he focused on The Heritage Foundation’s Project 2025 and the desire to basically eliminate the CDC as a recommending body for vaccines. I don’t think that even RFK Jr. would do that.

First, Dr. Offit describes ACIP and its history:

During the 1940s and 1950s, the United States Public Health Service (USPHS) relied on committees that met intermittently to address various vaccine issues. For example, in 1955, the USPHS convened experts to determine who should get Jonas Salk’s polio vaccine. By the early 1960s, with the licensure of new vaccines, it became evident that these committees needed to meet regularly. In March 1964, the Surgeon General created the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP), which was composed of experts in virology, immunology, microbiology, pediatrics, epidemiology, public health, and preventive medicine. The charge to the ACIP was clear: “The Committee shall concern itself with immunization schedules, dosages and routes of administration and indica­tions and contraindications for the use of these agents. The Committee shall also provide advice [to the CDC] regarding the relative merits and methods for conducting mass immunization programs.”

Since 1964, ACIP experts have recommended many safe and effective vaccines. Prior to these recommendations, every year in the United States polio caused 20,000 cases of paralysis and 1,500 deaths; measles caused 48,000 hospitalizations and 500 deaths; mumps was the most common cause of acquired deafness; rubella (German measles) caused 20,000 cases of congenital birth defects; rotavirus caused 70,000 hospitalizations from severe dehydration; and bacteria such as pneumococcus and Haemophilus influenzae type b (Hib) caused tens of thousands of cases of pneumonia, sepsis, and meningitis and hundreds of deaths. Thanks to vaccines, and the clear, strong recommendations by the ACIP and CDC, these diseases have been dramatically reduced or eliminated. Indeed, in a recent report published on August 8, 2024, researchers found that among 117 million children born between 1994 and 2023, CDC-recommended vaccines prevented about 500 million illnesses, 32 million hospitalizations, and 1.13 million deaths.

All of this is true, which is why I don’t think RFK Jr. would eliminate ACIP, even though he could. (The ACIP charter expires if it isn’t renewed every two years.) Rather, more likely he would subvert ACIP. The Secretary of HHS picks the members of ACIP, after a nomination and selection process. These members serve staggered terms, and the current roster has four members, including the chair Dr. Helen Keipp Talbot, whose term expires June 30, 2025, four whose terms expire in 2027, with the rest expiring in 2028. (The reason for this is that, for whatever reason, the Biden administration left a number of ACIP committee positions vacant after the members’ terms had expired and then appointed several new members in February.) By the end of a Trump administration, all members of ACIP could be replaced. Now imagine putting, say, RFK Jr. or his designee in charge of vetting potential new ACIP Members, a process that could be used to place four antivax and/or contrarian “scientists” and physicians on the committee next June, qualifications that prospective members be “acknowledged experts with an outstanding record of achievement in their own field and an understanding of the immunization issues covered by ACIP” be damned. Then in 2027, he could add four more, followed in 2028 by replacing the eight remaining voting members appointed this year.

Regular readers can only imagine the disaster that would be. Likely no new vaccines would be added to the CDC-recommended schedule, while some might even be removed, as committee members harass CDC and FDA scientists to torture the safety and efficacy data to make it “confess” that vaccines are unsafe and ineffective. I shudder at the thought. Of course, one thing that I do know about ACIP is that its conflict of interest reporting requirements are quite rigorous. That might keep the worst grifters off the committee, but I can’t guarantee that.

Can RFK Jr. succeed in destroying federal public health policy and programs?

There are many contradictions inherent in the MAHA movement that RFK Jr. has forged with Donald Trump. For example, RFK Jr. rails against the FDA as being too beholden to drug companies and quick to approve products without adequate evidence of efficacy and safety, while also wanting to lower the bar for the approval of the various quack treatments that he espouses, such as ivermectin for COVID-19 and cancer. He wants to make the FDA more strict and accountable, which, even if one could trust him to do this right, would run headlong into the interests of big business supporters of Trump in big pharma. One might easily see Trump being swayed to rein in or get rid of RFK Jr. because billionaires running pharmaceutical and medical device companies don’t like him interfering with their business. Given Trump’s history, who do you think Trump will listen to, his billionaire supporters or RFK Jr., whom he only took on as his health advisor (whatever position he ends up occupying) as an expedience, to get rid of a potential threat to his election?

Even so, and even considering that it will take years to accomplish what RFK claims to want to accomplish, be afraid. Be very afraid. Even if RFK Jr. accomplishes only a fraction what he promises, the damage to public health, the vaccination program, the FDA drug and device approval process, and federal science-based health policy in general, especially public health, will be incalculable. Previously controlled or even conquered vaccine-preventable infectious diseases are likely to return, although it might take a few years, by which time Trump will be out of office and his successor will be blamed. As for the rest, RFK Jr. will not “make America healthy again.” Far from it. He will jeopardize the health of Americans by making them vulnerable to infectious disease, keeping the FDA from approving safe and effective medications while encouraging it approve quackery of which he approves, and subjecting them to foodborne illness in the pursuit of the “natural,” like raw milk. And I haven’t even gotten into how he could change the rules at CMS to force it to pay for quackery under Medicare and Medicaid.

The next four years will be a disaster for science-based health policy and programs. The only question is: How bad? Again, my thought is: Plenty bad, man, and I haven’t even talked about RFK Jr.’s plans for the NIH yet. Let’s just say that he’s looking to pervert what is arguably the greatest engine of biomedical science and discovery ever created into Lysenko 2.0. More on that, sadly, soon enough.

By Orac

Orac is the nom de blog of a humble surgeon/scientist who has an ego just big enough to delude himself that someone, somewhere might actually give a rodent's posterior about his copious verbal meanderings, but just barely small enough to admit to himself that few probably will. That surgeon is otherwise known as David Gorski.

That this particular surgeon has chosen his nom de blog based on a rather cranky and arrogant computer shaped like a clear box of blinking lights that he originally encountered when he became a fan of a 35 year old British SF television show whose special effects were renowned for their BBC/Doctor Who-style low budget look, but whose stories nonetheless resulted in some of the best, most innovative science fiction ever televised, should tell you nearly all that you need to know about Orac. (That, and the length of the preceding sentence.)

DISCLAIMER:: The various written meanderings here are the opinions of Orac and Orac alone, written on his own time. They should never be construed as representing the opinions of any other person or entity, especially Orac's cancer center, department of surgery, medical school, or university. Also note that Orac is nonpartisan; he is more than willing to criticize the statements of anyone, regardless of of political leanings, if that anyone advocates pseudoscience or quackery. Finally, medical commentary is not to be construed in any way as medical advice.

To contact Orac: [email protected]

107 replies on “RFK Jr. as HHS Secretary will be a catastrophe for public health and medical research”

At least there is ONE bit of good news regarding the RFK pick and that is Queer Fluid mental/physical needs will finally be taken seriously.

Other than that, God help us.

As you pointed out before, some of the worst follies made by this country during the last century have been the Vietnam War, the Iraq War, and the election of Donald Trump.

In the seasonally appropriate words of Tom Lehrer, “Brother, here we go again.”

There are two reasons for Felon34’s choices for Cabinet positions:

1 – to just tear things up, simply to show he can.

2 – to see who in the Senate is … disloyal … by voting against his nominee. Names will be saved for die Nacht der lange Messer.

(h/t My Beloved and Darling Wife for pointing this out.)

fusilier

James 2:24

I weep for the USA, and, when the USA coughs, the rest of the world catches it. We’re all in deep shit.

Over two weeks ago ( DMSO post) I mentioned the “dream team” of RFK Jr, Tulsi, Elon. I hate being right.

MY SO asked me to write -on one sheet of paper- all that is wrong with RFK jr’s position for when he talks to his former co-workers ( several are right-wing)..an impossible task but I boiled it down to listing 1. his beliefs in specific conspiracy theories / pseudoscience and 2. his COIs- his law firms to sue companies, payment from CHD and book sales as well as general fame and admiration.

The alt med fanatics/ anti-vaxxers I follow are quite pleased as punch with RFK jr .

About the Senate approval: I heard on TV that there is a way he can possibly dodge that if DJT appoints him when Congress is not in session

@ Orac:
I hope things settle down for you and that your parents do better. Believe me, I know what you’re experiencing having been there myself.

I left out from my description:
—RFK Jr has NO relevant background ( education, training, job experience) in medicine, biology, psychology or education.
Thus, he cites “experts” who are as deficient as he is.

— For a “health expert”, doesn’t he look much older than 70? I have purses that look younger than he does.

Someone suggested that today in NY Times comments to Waynep Tufecki’s column! Others think it’s the heroin or brain worm.

Wow, thank you for pointing this out. We have been so blessed under Joe Biden with the international health organization star and current head of HHS, Xavier Bacerra. And thankfully, the entire Earth had Tedros Ghebreyesus to guide it through Covid as the head of the World Health Organization, who previous job was a terrorist.

I have a high respect for medical experts, actually thank Goodness for people like Salk and Sabin, and understand the miracle of human knowledge figuring out things. While they had their drawbacks and Covid policy worldwide was chaotic and often bereft of its senses, I understand that the vaccines (thanks to Trump for fast-tracking them) were works of genius.

But Kennedy’s holistic/preventative approach is the right approach to overall public health in conjunction to proven vaccine regimens.

To the extent these posts are filled with “Trump is Crazy” speeches, Trump represents the reaction in many fields to the failures of our educated, elite, leaders. “Lucretius” above wails about the Vietnam War and the Iraq War. Well, who brought those upon us but Kennedy’s “Best and Brightest” and Donald Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney (now Head Coach of the Dems, with his daughter the starting quarterback), and other “guys who know their way around.”

And by the way, with almost 100% certainty, I state that Covid started in a Chinese lab. I know that because I follow the science–the political science. China is run by mass murdering Communists for whom incompetence (such as Chernobyl) is second nature and lying is their first nature. Whoops, a mistake. Murder is their first nature.

Bothsiderism will be the death of us all. In the name of balance, we enable the dishonest and ignorant. Remember equal time arguments coming from creationists? If we hear about a political argument, will hear about any lies coming from both sides even if one side’s are 10x more numerous and 10x more severe.

Which of the two, the multi-party (if overshadowed by political violence) election of March or the exercise in rubber-stamping of November?

Just to add: ACIP (and VRBPAC) members are also removable at will by the Secretary.

And ACIP recommendations trigger the ACA preventive coverage provisions. If they change, some routine vaccines may not be covered anymore.

I think one of the saddest responses from a Trump voter was the one who voted for him because she thought he would get rid of ‘Obamacare’ but protect the ACA.

People’s unwillingness to do any research before making a decision they will be stuck with for four years is both amazing and appalling.

On the bright side, the health and medical disaster will fade from relevance as the disaster caused by Trump turbo-charging climate change starts to hit.

There are also news reports Jay Battacharya is a contender for leading the NIH. I have a bad feeling he will end up somewhere in the Trump administration.

Well, sure. Tulsi Gabbard, a Putinist, as director of national intelligence? Our allies will stop sharing intelligence with us, lest it go straight to Putin’s ear. That will screw us up in so many ways.

Speaking as a citizen of one of those allies (Canada) it’s not like we trusted the U.S. to reliably share intelligence with us anyway. There was a case a few years ago where Canada was left rather deliberately out of the loop regarding a specific U.S./Australia deal involving the China Sea and sales of nuclear submarines. (That last is admittedly likely the reason why Canada was left out, because Canadian policy involves no nuclear capabilities in its navy, which has unfortunately meant the Canadian Navy has very little in the way of modern submarine fleet.)

We HAVE working submarines?

What we don’t have are any icebreakers especially nuclear-powered ones.
So much for Arctic sovereignty.

Russia has something like nine and a couple more monsters under construction. They have enough they can use one for tourist cruises!

And Jay Batsy what’s his name to run NIH. The opinion pieces I’m reading about how we just have to calm down and show the honest anti-vaxxers the data are truly hilarious.
People are going to die.

Yikes. Trump, ignorantly and unwittingly, is hell bent on turning the U.S,. into a shithole nation. Don’t underestimate the imbecility of the Republican Party in bringing this to fulfillment, with a religious zeal.

It’s Russian revenge for the 1990s.

Trump may not realize this. He probably thinks everything’s a great idea.

While googling for news of Bhattacharya being put in charge of NIH I saw that he had been awarded by the American Academy of Science and Letters, an esteemed academy that has Meryl Streep as a life time member, a medal for protecting free speech. What the actual hell? Orac, you must know something. Spill.

The American Academy of Science and Letters was formed in 2022 by the right wing CEO of an investment fund through the John and Daria Barry Foundation (previously known as the Invisible Hand Foundation). Its role is to promote right-wing causes within academia.

I am an epidemiologist in Florida who ended up leaving the Department of Health after Ladapo was brought in. He’s the worst. When he was introduced as surgeon general on a state-wide call, he condescendingly told us that we were going to start doing data-driven public health rather than making fear-based decisions. It was insulting to all of the great public health staff we had who had been working ridiculous hours with inadequate staffing for months at that time (Florida really did have a strong public health system at one point). Not to mention, we all knew he was full of shit. Now that Bhattacharya has been announced for NIH, I imagine Ladapo could easily be Surgeon General or CDC Director. This is shaping up to be such a disaster for the country and the public health system. I am definitely going to count on your blog to help me make it through the next few years.

We’re going to have to pay him more. Seriously though, it looks like staying informed of truthful (and tragic) information is going to be much harder than it as the first go round. The “very serious people” in government and academia are all writing that we have to find common ground with MAGA and if we show them the data everything will be fine. Meanwhile non-Fox-like reporters are signaling they’re not going to piss em off

Despite having reluctantly voted for Trump, I ended up consoling a certain beloved family member who voted for Harris. So I understand how you guys feel and I am not going to rub anything in your faces.

I am really not sure if Trump will actually survive to inauguration. Unlike Putin, who speaks softly but has a hidden agenda, Trump seems to be extremely bombastic and I am not sure how far his “agenda” will actually advance.

I hope that we will soon develop new, well-financed, data and love-of-humans driven science. Those opposing the new science will be, of course, antiscience. Since we will have new epistemic authorities who will tell us the difference between conspiracy theories and facts, new conspiracy theories will be identified and old “conspiracy theories” will become facts, widely acknowledged by new epistemic authorities.

A medical denier voting for Donald. Not surprising at all. Hope you and yours don’t need Medicare or coverage for pre-existing conditions.

“I didn’t think the leopards would eat MY face” said the person who voted for the Leopards Eating Peoples’ Faces Party.

I am actually a liberal minded individual. I voted for Obama, which I do not regret.

However, in the last few years the democratic party went insane, with Covid vaccine mandates and other things, so I decided to vote to stop it.

Get this, the Democratic party has a webpage “who we serve”. It lists a bunch of constituencies who it serves. But it does not list white men, to whom I belong. It is like they are in an internal competition who is the most craziest liberal, and the winners get to make policy. That’s insane.

As soon as the Democratic party starts serving good people like me, I just might vote for it. I generally dislike the Republican party. But I felt like I had no choice.

“As soon as the Democratic party starts serving good people like me”

Wow. We can skip over the “they went crazy” part since the thing you object to there is the party’s support for rational steps to combat the pandemic, and you’ve repeatedly shown you disagree with what science says should be done.

But objecting to the “who we serve” statement because it doesn’t list “good people like me” really shows what a bigoted, racist, POS you truly are. Your complaint is as offensive as the white supremacist pushed “All lives matter” BS.

You are right. I am not a perfect person. I have certain phobias and many biases. The only perfect thing about me is my credit score of 850. (which shows that I am a very responsible and conscientious individual, however imperfect in other respects)

But I vote in every election, so feel free to continue to insult and guilt trip me and let’s see how well that works for you and your agenda!

A perfect credit score says nothing about your responsibility, and certainly nothing about your decency or honesty.

The fact that you vote is simply another data point in explaining why we have a president elect that is a criminal and totally incapable of doing a good job: he’s supported by suckers like you.

“Despite having reluctantly voted for Trump,…”

What a line of shit. You’re anti-vaxx, same as trump and his cronies. You’re a misogynist, so is he. You view women as objects and nothing more, so does he. You’re a conspiracy monger, so is he. You feel no responsibility to provide accurate information to others, neither does he. You’re a serial liar, so is he.
You voted for him because he reflects everything you believe and do. Nothing more.

I hope that we will soon develop new, well-financed, data and love-of-humans driven science. Those opposing the new science will be, of course, antiscience. Since we will have new epistemic authorities who will tell us the difference between conspiracy theories and facts, new conspiracy theories will be identified and old “conspiracy theories” will become facts, widely acknowledged by new epistemic authorities.

That’s a new level of meaningless crap, even for you.

I dunno. I rather liked that bit of Igor’s comment. The previous right wing, anti-science attitude was that you couldn’t trust a scientist because they got paid to do their jobs. Now Igor tacitly admits that the new regime will be animated only by it’s masters voice.

You are right.

A long time ago, at University of Chicago, I studied microeconomics. And the professor explained to us that people follow incentives.

Since that lecture, the world has not changed and people still follow incentives. What will change is the incentives.

Some sciences are more resistant to incentives shaping their conclusions, for example physics. After all, if we get physics wrong, space satellites would not fly, computers will not compute, and so on.

Some sciences, sadly, are more susceptible to money and politics getting desired conclusions. Those usually center around group interests and various controversies.

There is a small probability that the Kennedy’s leadership of HHS will actually improve confidence in vaccines. For example, if they publicly release various data, previously not released, that would show that vaccines do not cause various problems that they are accused of causing, that would be a huge boon to public confidence. Surely bad analyses would also be published, but hopefully good ones will also be done to validate how allegedly safe vaccines are.

The Covid disaster, with the virus and vaccine financed and developed by the same people, and the vaccine spectacularly failing, certainly dented vaccine confidence, for a very good reason. Hopefully soon investigations and apologies will follow.

For example, if they publicly release various data, previously not released, that would show that vaccines do not cause various problems that they are accused of causing, that would be a huge boon to public confidence.

The reams of studies and data now that show vaccines don’t cause the issues you and others say they do haven’t worked: the stuff you suggest won’t either, since you and people like you would simply make up more problems, just as you have so far.

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blockquote>The Covid disaster, with the virus and vaccine financed and developed by the same people

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blockquote>

Covid was a world-wide disaster, but it was, as the bulk of current data indicates, neither developed nor financed by anyone. This goes back to the problem mentioned above: no matter what the data shows, people like you will cling to the lies you prefer.

and the vaccine spectacularly failing

Nope, no spectacular, or even every day level, failure there. Just more repeated lies from you.

“For example, if they publicly release various data, previously not released, that would show that vaccines do not cause various problems that they are accused of causing”

Kennedy would block the release of this data. Like Trump, RFK doesn’t listen to anyone who isn’t parroting his own position back at him. I suspect that anything he releases will be carefully selected and carefully spun.

You guys are really going over the deep end about the Rfk jr pick. Calm down! Take a deep breath and repeat these soothing words: pharma is good and the health of mankind is their priority. Let’s try this again. Breathe in and out: pharma is good and the health of mankind is their priority.

OK, so that didn’t work and you guys are still outraged? Well, where is the outrage that the US spend the most on Healthcare yet they’re the sickest industrialized nation? Where is the outrage about the revolving door between the FDA and pharma?

Big Pharma makes drugs that save lives and improve quality of life. Big Pharma also engages in deceptive, unethical practices, and are sometimes aided, and sometimes opposed, by the FDA. The problem with the conservatives is that they usually identify the wrong problems with these companies.

Big Pharma also engages in deceptive, unethical practices, and are sometimes aided, and sometimes opposed, by the FDA

Matt, such a dismissive comment actually supports my point that it is not really the potential threat to public health that is getting you guys so riled up about the Kennedy pick. So, the FDA ‘sometimes’ aid Big Pharma’s deceptive and unethical practices, oh well, whadya gonna do?!

Matt, the FDA is supposed to be Big Phama’s watch dog! When they are not, or worse, conspiring with them, we should be screaming to the high heavens about it. Are we cool with the police ‘sometimes’ aiding murders? How about the fire department ‘sometmes’ aiding arson.

“Matt, the FDA is supposed to be Big Phama’s watch dog!”

I wouldn’t worry about that. When the FDA is gone there won’t even be a half hearted watchdog. Fear not, social media will fill the vacancy.

Trump’s supporters include those who fiercely resent the FDA and any scientists or lawmakers intent on holding up approval of questionable drugs or reining in excesses of pharma. For example, there’ve been plenty of op-eds and editorials in the Wall St. Journal to that effect. These people would be overjoyed to see the FDA abolished and “the market” determining what drugs are sold.

Anti-FDA shouters are like antivaxers drooling at the prospect of abolishing vaccine requirements. Both paths lead to spectacularly increased profits for pharma.

Own stock in Merck and Sanofi-Aventis, Fred?

Canada spends about half as much per capita and covers everybody, since they have national health care. They also had much lower covid death rates. It has problems, it’s not a perfect system. I don’t expect Junior to do diddly squat to increase coverage – instead he will serve a regime that wants to gut Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, protections in ACA to cover people with pre-existing conditions, etc. Don’t make Polio great again.

“Breathe in and out: pharma is good and the health of mankind is their priority.”

Why would you think that? Why do you think the FDA exists? It was created because of the adulteration of both food and medicine, which is explained in Deberah Blum’s excellent book: “The Poison Squad.”

How many babies were born with birth defects due to thalidomide in the USA? Here is a hint: https://www.respectfulinsolence.com/2015/08/10/a-tribute-to-dr-frances-oldham-kelsey-a-woman-who-made-a-difference/

Big Pharma would love to have RFKjr dismantle the FDA, the CDC, etc. They would make much more money. Just like the supplement companies after DSHEA was passed: https://www.respectfulinsolence.com/2009/03/11/will-the-government-ever-regulate-supple/

What really piss big Pharma now is negotiating Medicare drug prices (a real hit to profits). But first thing Robert Kennedy Jr will do is going against Big Flour.

Dr. Deborah Birx, who served in Trump’s first administration, appeared on CBS’ “Face the Nation,” where she was asked at length about Kennedy potentially leading the agency. and his views on health issues such as vaccines.

“That’s why when he talks about transparency, I’m actually excited that in a Senate hearing he would bring forward his data and the questions that come from the senators would bring forth their data,” Birx said of Kennedy. “What I know for sure is he’s a very smart man who can bring his data and his evidence base forward.”

Actually, I am with Dr Birx here considering that the confirmation hearing might actually not be too good for you guys. Do you really want to give Kennedy a spotlight where he exposes to the world the voodoo science behind the mantra that vaccines don’t cause autism? This is the sort of platform that Kennedy lives for and that’s why he keeps offering bets to scientists to debate him. Seriously, are the senators considering bringing forward actual scientists or doctors to confront Kennedy in such a public forum? Which scientist or doctor is going to risk having his ass handed to him?

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fmr-trump-wh-covid-doc-excited-questions-rfk-confirmation-hearing

I expect RFK Jr. will not come out very well from hearings in which he will have to address adventures with roadkill, extreme conspiracy theories, and sexual harassment. I would not be too excited.

Kennedy had a lot of time to provide his data, and his success has been… dismal. His books are sub-standard, and promote such extreme ideas as HIV denial – and ignore the studies that show him wrong, to give one example of an issue. His articles are consistently misleading. You do realize that Orac has extensively responded to his claims? Maybe you should search for Kennedy in the search box.

Right!

Senator Orac interviewing Kennedy at the Hearing.

Senator Orac: Mr Kennedy, and what do you have to say about your ridiculous claim that no vaccine has gone through the most regorius safety testing?!

Kennedy: It’s true. No vaccine has been tested against a true placebo

Senator Orac: Haha! And there you have it my fellow Senators. Mr Kennedy is right that no vaccine has been tested against a true placebo, but he is missing something very important. It’s unethical to test vaccines against a true placebo, so essentially Mr Kennedy is wrong!

Senator Orac: Mr Kennedy, you have also peddled the nonsense that Covid vaccines weren’t properly tested, please explain?!

Kennedy: Senator Orac, let me get into that evidence. When the pandemic broke….

Senator Orac: Liar! My fellow Senators, why are we even allowing this crank to testify? That’s giving false balance. Mr Kennedy is a dangerous antivaxx quack, and I urge you all to do the sensible thing and reject is confirmation.

This true placebo thing again. Senator Orac will explain medical ethics: placebo cannot be used if an efficient treatment is available.
First vaccine will be tested agains placebo .
Remember that there was a FOIA request about FDA COVID vaccine documents ? No smoking guns.

Dorit, is there something illegal or unethicval about eating roadkill?

It is not something I ever did, and currently I am vegan, but I am not sure what is the exact problem with someone picking up roadkill to eat.

He said he used the meat in his freezer to feed his falcons Igor. Don’t forget that he just dumped the head of a bear in Central Park. Authorities say had he been discovered doing that he could have faced charges.

What’s the problem with picking up roadkill to eat? Only a guess, but I’d say if something has been dead for an unknown period of time, outside, by the road, eating it would be a huge risk. I know a few people who have hit and killed a deer and gotten it dressed quickly at the time, and eaten it, but not for me.

Odd note: I never hunted, but when I was in high school the opening of deer season was a big deal for loads of classmates. One “tradition” many guys shared: when they got their deer and were field dressing it, they’d take a bite from the liver. Always seemed very dicey to me.

The roadkill story is more of “it hurts my sensibilities” than something involving moral turpitude. Falcons probably loved the roadkill and the roadkill was already dead.

By the way, I remembered something. I own a commercial building and there is a high voltage electric transmission line next to it.

During migration periods, geese flying at night routinely hit the powerlines and fall dead on my property. Not “roadkill” but close, right? Back when I was not vegan, I picked one such goose, which was still warm. I dressed it and made ground meat patties from the meat and some vegetables such as carrots and onions. (ground because their meat is too tough to eat whole)

The patties were delicious.

Also to my utter surprise, eating them game me some incredible jolt of energy for a couple of days.

I posted an answer and it somehow did not go through – let me try again.

A. These are political hearing, so even if it were not illegal, it could be raise against him. The hearing is to determine if he’s fit for high office, not to send him to jail. Arguably, some of his past adventures show that he may not be. As do his extreme conspiracy theorist views, of course.

B. Yes, some of his escapades – like dropping a bear in Central Park – were illegal.

C. I note that the commenter did not give any weight to the sexual assault issue.

I posted an answer and it somehow did not go through – let me try again. I’m using another browser, and hope it will go through and not post twice.

A. These are political hearing, so even if it were not illegal, it could be raise against him. The hearing is to determine if he’s fit for high office, not to send him to jail. Arguably, some of his past adventures show that he may not be. As do his extreme conspiracy theorist views, of course.

B. Yes, some of his escapades – like dropping a bear in Central Park – were illegal.

C. I note that the commenter did not give any weight to the sexual assault issue.

Part of the response to the anti-vaccine trope that vaccines were not tested against a placebo is, in fact, the fact that sometimes it’s unethical to use a saline placebo (for example for combination vaccines), and in fact, other controls are also valid.

Another part is that many vaccines were tested against a placebo initially.
https://www.microbe.tv/twiv/twiv-1026/

Of course, COVID-19 vaccines were tested against saline placebo.

But again, if you think Kennedy would do well in testing his views, you likely haven’t been paying attention to the responses to his false claims. And you are ignoring the way such political hearings work. Kennedy isn’t in very good shape to withstand them. For example, when asked about his claim that the brains of autistic children are gone, what will he say? That yes, he’s contemptuous of such children, does not really understand the disorder, but he heard from anti-vaccine activists that vaccines are causing it, so he is for letting children die from diphtheria?

I am pretty sure the anti-vaccine folks don’t give a fig about placebos. They use them as a gotcha: “See, you pro-vaccine folks are all sciency and stuff, and you say that tests against placebos are some kind of standard, so by your own rules vaccines are inadequately tested!”

I think you’re right, but it’s a pretty effective talking point towards those not committed to anti-vaccine views, so it’s still important to counter it.

The overwhelming majority of antivaxers are grossly ignorant about the nature and use of placebos, and refuse to be educated about them.

Actually, I would be excited to see a data-driven discussion at Kennedy’s confirmation hearing, because it would not go well for Kennedy. Alas, I am resigned to seeing data ignored in favour of lies and conspiracy theories.

Kennedy has had 2 decades to provide his data on vaccines. Instead from Kennedy we get a mix of lies, fractional truths and conspiracy theories. In 2005 Kennedy wrote an article titled Deadly Immunity published by Salon and Rolling Stone. Salon, after publishing numerous corrections to the article, eventually retracted the article as they no longer had any faith in the accuracy of the article.

Kennedy’s ability to present accurate data has not improved in the 19 years since. I have no faith in that changing between now and any confirmation hearing, but, as a scientist, I am always open to being proven wrong with data.

Agreed.

In addition, “Bobby”, Super-sleuth of Science, in his devastating investigations somehow failed to uncover thousands of studies that show, in minute detail, how autism develops prenatally, throughout gestation, and afterward- from genetic differences that result in neurological anomalies in the micro-architecture of the PFC which are studied by autopsy, results of abortion, MRI, brain waves, physiognomy and observation of very young infants. These events can be pinned down to precise trimester and counting excess number of cells/ faulty connections. Autistic brains are different and didn’t get that way from a vaccine. They were already that way.
Since the 1980s, knowledge has been accumulating ( Eric Courchesne, Karen Pierce, Ed Lein, Chris Aldridge, Sally Ozonoff and many other researchers in the US and globally).

Trump will do recess appointments for nominees like RFKjr.
Nothing will come to light in any hearings because there won’t be any hearings
Trump doesn’t care about ethics, law or morality.
Trump’s allies have been doing massive numbers of FOIA requests for emails of federal employees to look for those who would oppose Trump, and those they find will be fired on day 1.
The closest thing to a tyrant will be ruling the US in January, and RFKjr is no long a court jester.

Just to clarify something (not to counter your point – I think it’s likely Trump will at least try this) – if the Senate goes on recess, Trump would likely make all appointments there. The recess has to be at least 10 days, so it is not likely to be only for one or two appointments.

” those they find will be fired on day 1″

And, I suspect, if that proves too difficult, the work locations for their jobs will be relocated to the farthest hinterlands of the country, forcing people to to relocate or quit. The goal of trump and his bootlickers (controllers is probably better) in the fake “DOGE” group is to dismantle as much of government in general as they can, consequences be damned (since the libertarian billionaire scum aligned with trump won’t feel any of the consequences).

Of the numerous political movements labelled as “populist”, the closest to being the original is likely the Free Silver movement led by William Jennings Bryan in the late 19th Century: “To increase the money supply by freely coining silver, which was believed to help raise prices for farm goods and ease debt burdens.” The idea was fiercely opposed by bankers and industrialists, who insisted on a strict gold standard, and thus were the target of Bryan’s famous speech “you shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold!”

Why do I mention this? Because many cultural historians have argued that L. Frank Baum’s The Wizard of Oz is a populist allegory. Dorothy is a Kansas farm girl, uprooted by natural disaster, told to seek respite from the Wizard of Oz (oz. being the measure of gold) in the big capital city at the end of the yellow brick (gold) road. Along the way she gathers allies in the Scarecrow (farmer) Tin Man (industrial labor) and Cowardly Lion (Bryan). They discover the Wizard (Mr. Gold) is a fraud, and Dorothy gets home thanks to her (in the book) silver slippers.

So now our fake populist autocrat, who dances to the tune of the wealthy and screws over the common people who believe in his magic has appointed a fraud supposed medical wizard named Oz to run (dismantle?) the public sector healthcare so many of those common folk depend on.

Could the sad irony be more perfect?

Of the numerous political movements labelled as “populist”, the closest to being the original is likely the Free Silver movement led by William Jennings Bryan in the late 19th Century: “To increase the money supply by freely coining silver, which was believed to help raise prices for farm goods and ease debt burdens.” The idea was fiercely opposed by bankers and industrialists, who insisted on a strict gold standard, and thus were the target of Bryan’s famous speech “you shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold!”

Why do I mention this? Because many cultural historians have argued that L. Frank Baum’s The Wizard of Oz is a populist allegory. Dorothy is a Kansas farm girl, uprooted by natural disaster, told to seek respite from the Wizard of Oz (oz. being the measure of gold) in the big capital city at the end of the yellow brick (gold) road. Along the way she gathers allies in the Scarecrow (farmer) Tin Man (industrial labor) and Cowardly Lion (Bryan). They discover the Wizard (Mr. Gold) is a fraud, and Dorothy gets home thanks to her (in the book) silver slippers.

So now our fake populist autocrat, who dances to the tune of the wealthy and screws over the common people who believe in his magic has appointed a fraud supposed medical wizard named Oz to run (dismantle?) the public sector healthcare so many of those common folk depend on.

Could the sad irony be more perfect?

Of the numerous political movements labelled as “populist”, the closest to being the original is likely the Free Silver movement led by William Jennings Bryan in the late 19th Century: “To increase the money supply by freely coining silver, which was believed to help raise prices for farm goods and ease debt burdens.” The idea was fiercely opposed by bankers and industrialists, who insisted on a strict gold standard, and thus were the target of Bryan’s famous speech “you shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold!”

Why do I mention this? Because many cultural historians have argued that L. Frank Baum’s The Wizard of Oz is a populist allegory. Dorothy is a Kansas farm girl, uprooted by natural disaster, told to seek respite from the Wizard of Oz (oz. being the measure of gold) in the big capital city at the end of the yellow brick (gold) road. Along the way she gathers allies in the Scarecrow (farmer) Tin Man (industrial labor) and Cowardly Lion (Bryan). They discover the Wizard (Mr. Gold) is a fraud, and Dorothy gets home thanks to her (in the book) silver slippers.

So now our fake populist autocrat, who dances to the tune of the wealthy and screws over the common people who believe in his magic has appointed a fraud supposed medical wizard named Oz to run (dismantle?) the public sector healthcare so many of those common folk depend on.

Could the sad irony be more perfect?

This whole election is a disaster, for your close allies too. The polluted internet has a lot to answer and I wonder if Trump would have been elected without the spread of Qanon and its many delusional derivatives as well as RFK’s populist gibberish?

It’s rather like a football team appointing the hooligan supporter of rival team as their manager!

Keep up the good work – the world needs sense and science more than ever.

https://drcolinbannon.substack.com/p/trumps-wrecking-ball

RFK Jr knows so much about medicine/ research that he takes testosterone despite having A-Fib since his university days which required several electro-conversion procedures/ hospital stays when he was older. He believes his vocal condition may have been caused by flu vaccines. During the pandemic, he told his aged mother to avoid Covid vaccines.
Plus his lack of knowledge about what actually ’causes’ autism.

Trump’s going to be sorry he appointed RFK, Jr. My man is going to expose every bit of fraud in the “vaccine” program that the senile old fool rushed through and promoted, and will prosecute him for mass assault on American health!

You are expecting an awful from a guy who decided to warn the world of the dangers of mercury in vaccines at least four years after they were removed from pediatric vaccines: https://oracknows.blogspot.com/2005/06/saloncom-flushes-its-credibility-down.html

By the way, anti-vaxxers were having problems getting vaccines with thimerosal for their “studies” in 2001 (that 24 year old link still works):

Subject: Thimerosal DTaP Needed
From: Sally Bernard
Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 00:01:50 -0400
Yahoo! Message Number: 27456
Onibasu Link: http://onibasu.com/archives/am/27456.html

Hi all:

A group of university-based researchers needs several vials of the older DTaP vaccine formulations which contained thimerosal for a legitimate research study. If anyone knows an MD who might have some of these vaccines or knows where to get them, please email me privately.

Thank you.

Sallie Bernard
Executive Director
Safe Minds

I LOLed when I first saw that paper. I have no idea what the editor was thinking when they accepted the cash for this spoof.

What a drama queen. All this for wearing a mask.I did have one,and did not feel tortured. If masks do not work, why surgeons use them ?

I had to laugh at the bit where she talked about peanut allergies. I mean, given the lack of any evidence produced by RFK, in fact by the entire pantheon lining JLBs walls, you’d think she would be more supportive of the medical hunch method of treatment.

For a Republican administration, abortion is a litmus test. Robert Kenned sy must persuade GOP senators that he is true blue pro lifer now.

[…] Ever since longtime antivaccine activist, supporter of “natural health” quackery, and fear mongered about food ingredients Robert F. Kennedy Jr. suspended his quixotic Presidential campaign and bent the knee to Donald Trump in exchange for a high-ranking health-related position in the Trump administration, should Trump win, I’ve been trying to warn my readers what it would actually mean if RFK Jr. were to gain influence. Unfortunately for health policy and biomedical science in the US, Donald Trump did eek out a narrow popular vote victory (49.9% to 48.3% thus far, and counting), with an Electoral College victory that hinged on a small number of votes in the usual swing states. After the election was declared, speculation was rampant over what role RFK Jr. would hold in the second Trump administration and what he and Trump would do. By September, RFK Jr. had coined the term “Make America Healthy Again” (MAHA), an obvious homage to Donald Trump’s longstanding slogan “Make America Great Again” (MAGA), although in his MAHA manifesto he hid his antivax proclivities, which his antivax followers did notice and were dismayed. Eventually, Trump announced that he was going to nominate RFK Jr. for the most important health-related cabinet position, Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS), where, if confirmed by the Senate, RFK Jr. would oversee a sprawling and massive department with a $2.86 trillion budget, as well as key agencies that fall under HHS, including the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the National Institutes of Health (NIH), the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), and the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS). Ten days ago, I outlined how having an antivax crank like RFK Jr. in charge of HHS would be a catastrophe for public health and biomedical research. […]

[…] Ever since longtime antivaccine activist, supporter of “natural health” quackery, and fear mongered about food ingredients Robert F. Kennedy Jr. suspended his quixotic Presidential campaign and bent the knee to Donald Trump in exchange for a high-ranking health-related position in the Trump administration, should Trump win, I’ve been trying to warn my readers what it would actually mean if RFK Jr. were to gain influence. Unfortunately for health policy and biomedical science in the US, Donald Trump did eek out a narrow popular vote victory (49.9% to 48.3% thus far, and counting), with an Electoral College victory that hinged on a small number of votes in the usual swing states. After the election was declared, speculation was rampant over what role RFK Jr. would hold in the second Trump administration and what he and Trump would do. By September, RFK Jr. had coined the term “Make America Healthy Again” (MAHA), an obvious homage to Donald Trump’s longstanding slogan “Make America Great Again” (MAGA), although in his MAHA manifesto he hid his antivax proclivities, which his antivax followers did notice and were dismayed. Eventually, Trump announced that he was going to nominate RFK Jr. for the most important health-related cabinet position, Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS), where, if confirmed by the Senate, RFK Jr. would oversee a sprawling and massive department with a $2.86 trillion budget, as well as key agencies that fall under HHS, including the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the National Institutes of Health (NIH), the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), and the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS). Ten days ago, I outlined how having an antivax crank like RFK Jr. in charge of HHS would be a catastrophe for public health and biomedical research. […]

[…] Ever since longtime antivaccine activist, supporter of “natural health” quackery, and fear mongered about food ingredients Robert F. Kennedy Jr. suspended his quixotic Presidential campaign and bent the knee to Donald Trump in exchange for a high-ranking health-related position in the Trump administration, should Trump win, I’ve been trying to warn my readers what it would actually mean if RFK Jr. were to gain influence. Unfortunately for health policy and biomedical science in the US, Donald Trump did eke out a narrow popular vote victory (49.9% to 48.3% thus far, and counting), with an Electoral College victory that hinged on a small number of votes in the usual swing states. After the election was declared, speculation was rampant over what role RFK Jr. would hold in the second Trump administration and what he and Trump would do. By September, RFK Jr. had coined the term “Make America Healthy Again” (MAHA), an obvious homage to Donald Trump’s longstanding slogan “Make America Great Again” (MAGA), although in his MAHA manifesto he hid his antivax proclivities, which his antivax followers did notice and were dismayed. Eventually, Trump announced that he was going to nominate RFK Jr. for the most important health-related cabinet position, Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS), where, if confirmed by the Senate, RFK Jr. would oversee a sprawling and massive department with a $2.86 trillion budget, as well as key agencies that fall under HHS, including the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the National Institutes of Health (NIH), the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), and the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS). Ten days ago, I outlined how having an antivax crank like RFK Jr. in charge of HHS would be a catastrophe for public health and biomedical research. […]

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