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Orac basks in the adoration of Gary Null

Orac loves to bask in the adulation of his “fans.” This time around, one of the old men of quackery, Gary Null, has decided that he really, really doesn’t like science-based medicine. That includes Steve Novella, Susan Gerbic, and…Orac.

One of the great rewards of doing what I do, having done it for over 13 years, and achieving some level of notoriety is basking in the adulation of my fans. I mean that in two ways, of course. The first way, as you might expect, is literal. it is rewarding to know that I’ve made a difference among those who are confused about medicine and various quack remedies, including antivaccine pseudoscience. Then there’s the other way, which consists mainly of the various hate mail that I receive. Particularly gratifying is when a high profile quack or supporter of quackery takes notice of my humble efforts. I will admit that there is definitely a downside to this latter adulation. After all, Mike Adams, a.k.a. the Health Ranger, has permanently poisoned my Google reputation with a two year campaign of defamation against me. On the other hand, the effort he and his minions took tells me that I’ve been effective. The same is true of Gary Null. Think of Gary Null as Mike Adams before there was a Mike Adams; indeed, his most hilarious screwup was when he accidentally poisoned himself with his own supplements.

Null’s been around since the 1970s, having cut his teeth publishing laudatory articles about cancer quacks like Stanislaw Burzynski. Null knows who I am, and he likes me. He’s said so by providing me with the quack adulation of an attack. Now, I’m informed, he’s doing it again. On his radio network, I find Wikipedia: Our New Technological McCarthyism, Part Two (partial transcript here). Yes, it’s part two, but it interests me more than part one because it mentions projects with which I’m intimately familiar and people with whom I work. For instance, he really, really doesn’t like science-based medicine:

Due to EBM’s shortcomings, an group who earlier advocated for EBM emerged. The Society for Science Based Medicine, founded by Yale neuroscientist Skeptic Steven Novella, was launched to advocate for a reductionist scientific rationality, founded upon Skepticism’s principles and militant propaganda strategies. In 2009, the Society launched its Institute for Science in Medicine, a non-profit organization with a mission to influence public health policies and establish standards based upon its medical determinism at the exclusion of other medical options that the Institute criticizes. High on both the Society’s and Institute’s priority list is the condemnation of Complementary-Alternative Medicine (CAM), which is today offered in most university medical schools. It also accuses naturopathy, homeopathy, massage, chiropractic medicine, nutritional medicine including supplements, and all faith-based and Mind-Body healing modalities of quackery.[7] Practitioners of these non-drug based therapies are categorically labeled as irrational, charlatans, conspiracy theorists or quacks. Followers of SBM operate solely in the state of its absolute authority, hyper-diligence and ultra- orthodoxy. Medical research favoring conventional medicine is framed as unwavering facts, which leave no room for open discussion and debate.

Null doesn’t know what he’s talking about here. The Institute for Science in Medicine (ISM) was not founded by the Society for Science-Based Medicine (SfSBM); it preceded SfSBM. There is some overlap in membership (including myself), but SfSBM flowed more out of a desire of some members of ISM to open another front in the battle for science and against quackery. On the other hand, Null is correct that one characteristic that both organizations share is is labeling quackery as quackery. I can’t speak for ISM any more, but I can say that SBM does not “categorically label” practitioners of CAM as “irrational, charlatans, conspiracy theorists or quacks.” We do, however, call out the charlatans, conspiracy theorists, and quacks among CAM practitioners. Regarding the rest, we not infrequently delve deeply into potential reasons why physicians might embrace CAM. As for framing medical research favoring conventional medicine as “unwavering facts,” there’s only one way to characterize such a statement: As the bullshit that it is. Has Null ever read some of the posts on mammography, for instance, that I’ve written? They are anything but framing studies as “unwavering facts.” Indeed, Null should take a look at this post in particular, where I point out how difficult that it is to determine whether mammography saves lives, and, if so, how many it saves.

It’s also not surprising that Null pulls the “academics” trope:

SBM is strictly a community of university professors and medical doctors. Very few have the luxury to spend hours day and night to survey the internet for people and groups to endlessly attack on blogs or monitor Wikipedia edits they disapprove of. Nor do most of them have the technological computer skills. To succeed in promulgating its ideology, they have recruited their admirers in the Skeptic organizations listed in our earlier segment to this series.

Except that it’s not. Harriet Hall, for instance, is not and never was an academic physician. She was an Air Force physician, now retired. Jann Bellamy is a lawyer. In fact, only some of the regulars at SBM are academic physicians. While it’s true that SBM founder Steve Novella is an academic neurologist at Yale, although for some reason Gary Null seems to think that the SBM editor comes from Wake Forest (see the first part of the series), which is yet another example of the very sloppy “research” that he did for his rant.

It isn’t long, of course (actually, it only took until part one) for Null to invoke the spectre of “militant atheism“:

The Center for Inquiry (SFI), the umbrella organization that serves as the mother chapel for the Skeptic movement, fully embraces Dawkins’ atheistic Scientism. In 2016, the Richard Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science merged with CFI. Its stated mission is to “foster a secular society based upon reason, science, freedom of inquiry and humanist values.”[14] Laudable words, but the Center fails horribly to tolerate, let alone respect, the freedom of others to their beliefs and the freedom to choose a medical intervention of their choice. Any discipline of inquiry that is performed outsides the Center’s narrow interpretation of science is condemned as heresy, exposed and publicly maligned. Everything that deals with religion and spirituality, the paranormal, unexplained phenomena, and alternative and natural medical modalities are accused of con-artistry. Other leading major Skeptic groups are the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry, the Council of Secular Humanism, the James Randi Educational Foundation and the SBM-related Commission for Scientific Medicine and Mental Health.

I do love how out of date Null’s information is. For instance, the James Randi Educational Foundation has basically folded. Sure, it still exists, and supposedly has converted itself into a grant-making foundation, but I haven’t heard anything about such grants being awarded since the JREF made that change. Indeed, its website appears not to have changed in two and a half years, the sole announcement since 2015 being in January, in which JREF announced that Susan Gerbic received the 2017 award from the JREF, saying that the award “is given to the person or organization that best represents the spirit of the foundation by encouraging critical questions and seeking unbiased, fact-based answers.” Whether any cash was associated with that award, I’ll have to ask Susan.

As for the rest, does Null not know that the Commission for Scientific Medicine and Mental Health has been moribund for years. The most recent articles on its website are from 2005, for cryin’ out loud! The most recent issue of Scientific Review of Mental Health Practice (SRMHP) was published in 2007. The most recent issue of the Scientific Review of Alternative Medicine (SRAM) was published in 2002. It’s sad, yes, very sad, and I do know that every now and then someone brings up the idea of trying to resurrect SRAM and SRMHP, but in reality they are probably no longer necessary given the rise of blogs and online publications.

Speaking of Susan Gerbic, Null really, really doesn’t like her. That’s not surprising, given that she’s created an organization, Guerilla Skepticism on Wikipedia (GSoW) dedicated to making sure that Wikipedia articles on topics with which skeptics concern themselves are scientifically accurate and that promoters of pseudoscience and quackery don’t manage to bias Wikipedia articles in favor of nonsense. Her group filled a definite need, and she answered the call. Indeed, the slogan of GSoW is, “The mission of the Guerrilla Skepticism editing team is to improve skeptical content of Wikipedia. We do this by improving pages of our skeptic spokespeople, providing noteworthy citations, and removing the unsourced claims from paranormal and pseudoscientific pages. Why? Because evidence is cool. We train – We mentor – Join us.” Of course, this is exactly the sort of thing that quacks cannot abide, which is why they’ve attacked Susan before. For instance, five years ago, Deepak Chopra was very upset at the GSoW treatment of woo-meister Rupert Sheldrake. As I pointed out at the time, there is indeed a movement afoot to correct scientific misinformation and try to keep the entries in Wikipedia scientifically accurate. Chopra complained about this as though it were a bad thing, which to him it was, because Susan’s activism keeps entries that have anything to do with the sorts of quackery and pseudoscience he believes in from being transformed by quacks to glorify and promote those selfsame forms of quackery and pseudoscience—or at least from presenting them as though they were true or even just as scientifically valid points of view.

So what does Null think of Gerbic and her activities? He’s not a fan:

One group that has received Wikipedia’s full support and swallowed Dawkin’s “militant atheism” whole with steroids is Guerrilla Skepticism on Wikipedia (GSoW). Founded by a woman who owns a small portrait gallery in Monterrey, Susan Gerbic is a close friend of SBM guru David Gorski who fully endorses her organization’s internet militancy. GSoW actively seeks out and trains recruits to serve as an army of a Skeptic editors to wage wiki wars against those who research or advocate alternative medical treatment modalities. These are the most active of Wikipedia’s independent advocates editing alternative medicine content and pages critical of conventional drugs. To further proselytize her extreme Skepticism globally, Gerbic later founded the World Wikipedia Project to reproduce her successes on foreign language Wikipedias.


On her personal Wikipedia biographical entry, Gerbic is quoted as saying, “We rewrite Wikipedia, and proof the pages, we remove citations that are not noteworthy, we add citations, we do just about everything in Wikipedia to improve content.”[12] Of course, the majority of their “notable citations” reference back to Skeptic and SBM sources, such as Gorski’s ScienceBasedMedicine blog. “Improvements” are solely aligned with Skepticism’s doctrine. Gerbic’s other organization Skeptic Action is another stealth guerilla operation to disseminate cyber tasks for Skeptic trolls on Twitter, Facebook and Google+ to rapidly rate pages such as books listed on Amazon that question vaccination, homeopathy, and natural cancer treatments. Skeptic Action also utilizes a community drive system, which enables members to receive rapid alerts to rebut content posted on the internet.

Gee, Null thinks this is a bad thing. That’s not surprising, because Wikipedia would be a great marketing tool for quacks, and a team of skeptics preventing pseudoscience and dubious references being inserted into Wikipedia entries is a major buzzkill when it comes to shiny happy propaganda about alternative medicine. Indeed, Null even inadvertently provides an example:

In this particular case, Debby Vajda, President for the Association for Comprehensive Energy Psychology (ACEP), provided 51 peer-reviewed articles and studies, 18 which were randomized controlled studies, appearing in professional journals, including the American Psychological Association, the Journal of Clinical Psychology, the Journal of Nervous and Mental Diseases, Psychotherapy Theory Research and Practice and others showing positive statistical results outside the range of chance. She commented on, “Every edit to the energy psychology Wikipedia page that attempts to reference findings from these well-respected, scientific journals is summarily deleted… The American Psychological Association does not think we are ‘lunatic charlatans.’ Neither does the Association of Social Work Boards, the National Board of Certified Counselors, or the National Association of Alcohol and Drug Abuse Counselors, all of which approve ACEP to provide continuing education to their professional members for the study of energy psychology. The Wikipedia page is out of step with existing peer-reviewed research on this topic, and opinionated, self-described “skeptic” editors are resisting any change.”[21]

Apparently the scientific evidence was insufficient to pass Wikipedia’s administration review. The page still defines Energy Medicine as a “pseudo-scientific belief.”[22]

See? Energy medicine “quacks” are trying to promote their quackery with the usual dubious pseudoscientific studies. Fortunately, Wikipedia is quite correct to define energy medicine as pseudoscience. As I like to say about reiki, for instance, it’s faith healing substituting Eastern mystical religious beliefs for the Christian beliefs usually used to justify faith healing. A list of the sorts of articles ACEP promotes as “rigorous” include the usual nonsense about Emotional Freedom Technique, acupuncture, thought field therapy, “Wholistic Hybrid Derived from Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing and Emotional Freedom Technique,” and the like. (EFT, which is pure wishful thinking quackery, seems to be very big among this group.)

Null is also very, very upset that skeptics are so hostile to The One Quackery To Rule Them All, homeopathy, whose principles violate multiple laws of physics. He views homeopathy as an example of what’s wrong with skepticism:

Homeopathy is an excellent example of Skepticism’s unsound and frequently unsubstantiated criticisms. Simply because SBM physicians may not understand biophysics, quantum energy, and physical properties of water should not close the door on homeopathy as mere quackery. Surely Skeptics will embrace the value of nanotechnology without understanding the physics of spatial quantum confinement behind it. Nanomedince is rapidly becoming part of conventional medicine’s drug arsenals. Safety studies for nano-drugs are weak at best. Yet there are analogous features to nanotechnology and homeopathic theory in terms of spatial physics and force. Furthermore, in Europe, homeopathy is a preferred alternative treatment modality among doctors. In India, where it is most popular, 62% of homeopathic users have never tried conventional drugs, and 82% of those in an AC Nielsen survey said they would not switch to allopathic treatments. In France, 94% of surveyed pharmacists acknowledged they recommend pregnant women to use homeopathic remedies instead of pharmaceutical drugs. Homeopathy is also taught in 21 of 24 French pharmacology schools. Seventy percent of French physicians approve of the discipline.[25]

Actually, it is because SBM physicians have an understanding of biophysics, quantum energy, and physical properties of water that we reject homeopathy as pseudoscience. It is because quacks like Null do not understand these things and are unduly impressed by the shiny, happy pseudoscience and mysticism invoking quantum physics as though it were magic. Also, one more time, homeopathy has nothing to do with nanoparticles, and appealing to homeopathy’s popularity is meaningless. You can be sure that Null won’t mention that homeopathy is big business in France (Boiron, anybody) and that powerful forces actually suppress criticism of homeopathy by SBM physicians. Yes, in France, criticizing homeopathy too vigorously can land you in a world of hurt, including complaints against you and even lawsuit, and the the Minister of Solidarity and Health fully supports homeopathy. In France, homeopathy is mainstream. To SBM, that’s a problem. To Null, it’s a good thing.

Null concludes:

Wikipedia is embedded with the frontline sychophants to attack those who would tell us the truth, the guardians of the social media galaxy. We are brainwashed 24-7 without warning. No trepidation. No open debate. We are solely passive consumers in Wales’ wiki matrix. Objectivists, as The Economist article notes, functions best when social conditions reinforce a bee-hive mentality. This is what enables Skeptic leaders such as Wales, Novella and Gorski to cling to their perceptions of intellectual superiority. In the meantime we have a compliant nation, a population obedient and only buying.

Project much? The people who would most benefit from a compliant nation, a population obedient and only buying, would be Gary Null, Mike Adams, and his fellow quacks. Certainly they’d benefit far more than any SBM proponent would. We have our pesky dedication to science that keeps us from taking full advantage of the free market. That’s why financially we’re always at a disadvantage—and not by a little. Null can never admit that, though, because his very business model depends on him portraying himself as an underdog fighting the system.

I can hardly wait for part three.

By Orac

Orac is the nom de blog of a humble surgeon/scientist who has an ego just big enough to delude himself that someone, somewhere might actually give a rodent's posterior about his copious verbal meanderings, but just barely small enough to admit to himself that few probably will. That surgeon is otherwise known as David Gorski.

That this particular surgeon has chosen his nom de blog based on a rather cranky and arrogant computer shaped like a clear box of blinking lights that he originally encountered when he became a fan of a 35 year old British SF television show whose special effects were renowned for their BBC/Doctor Who-style low budget look, but whose stories nonetheless resulted in some of the best, most innovative science fiction ever televised, should tell you nearly all that you need to know about Orac. (That, and the length of the preceding sentence.)

DISCLAIMER:: The various written meanderings here are the opinions of Orac and Orac alone, written on his own time. They should never be construed as representing the opinions of any other person or entity, especially Orac's cancer center, department of surgery, medical school, or university. Also note that Orac is nonpartisan; he is more than willing to criticize the statements of anyone, regardless of of political leanings, if that anyone advocates pseudoscience or quackery. Finally, medical commentary is not to be construed in any way as medical advice.

To contact Orac: [email protected]

123 replies on “Orac basks in the adoration of Gary Null”

Regarding Homeopathy and the memory of water, how do they account for adding memories/effects to water when water has existed in the water cycle for so long it must be homeopathic super water? Could I pour a small vial of homeopathic remedy into the oceans and let the water cycle carry cures across the world? Does the urine of someone using a homeopathic cure have a higher or lower C than the original cure they drank?

Homeopathy is frankly ridiculous on so many levels. Homeopathy is far from natural, unless you think maybe the water cycle dilutes stuff or something. Homeopath is farther from nature than vaccines, though. Vaccines, people observed that those exposed to a minor disease developed a resistance to it and also a more serious disease, so they extrapolated that observation and developed it until it became vaccines

If quacks were REALLY in to homeopathy, it would be a great idea for them to just dilute all the poison they tout for, including bleach enemas, antineoplestons, chelation, whatever magic herb flavor of the week, to the tiniest degree they can muster. Optionally, homeopaths can just screw off and just pursue water purification which they’re apparently good at doing, I guess, but that advice to screw off doesn’t work well because they have money to make.

It appears that Null as a last name is appropriate for this bozo. It states both his understanding of science and his ability find data.

If water has memory, then we can blame all our problems on dinosaur piss. Just think, autism, cancer, the common cold, every disease, wars etc can be blamed on water’s memory of dinosaur piss. (sarcasm)

The French approval of homeopathy is really troubling. I remember one of your minions mentioned a pediatrician homeopath that was disciplined, and it was jarring then.

Anyone know what the status of homeopathy is in Germany? I know it’s popular, but is it also established?

I just got back from lecturing in Germany Dorit. It is bad. I met there, what a lovely person. She has a new book out on it (in German only at the moment) She tells me that she receives death threats because of her speaking out against homeopathy.

BTW, GSoW wrote her Wikipedia page in English as well as yours Dorit. 🙂 🙂

We toured the GWUP headquarters while there (a CSI-like office) and they showed us what they are doing to fight there. Also they showed us some homeopathy made from the Berlin wall – can you guess what it “cures”?

The article on this trip to Germany can be found here..

That does sound horrible.

I don’t know what the Berlin Wall cure is for – anxiety? Conflict? (I could google it, I know, but that would be cheating).

It’s quite bad, and regular insurance even covers homeopathy. Just an example of the general popularity – when you walk into a pharmacy and ask for any OTC stuff, you’ll usually be asked – do you want something chemical, something natural, or something homeopathic.

Unfortunately, a lot of doctors seem to embrace some sort of quackery, homeopathy/acupuncture being the most popular (in my experience). As a patient, I’ve really had a hard time finding a “Praxis” in my city, where at least one of the doctors doesn’t offer some kind of SCAM. The only such center I managed to find was in a university clinic, a very specific endocrinology department, but that’s about it.

Then again, homeopathy comes from Germany in the first place, there is also the ancient, idiotic tradition of Heilpraktiker or “healers” who can treat patients without any medical education, and other signs of a medical system that is a lot less regulated than one would expect from otherwise quite advanced country.

Just to worry you a little more have a look at Heilpraktiker in Germany.

A heilpraktiker does not need to have any formal education or training but must do an exam at the health authorities.

I think they make naturopaths seem over-qualified.

Some of Edzard Ernst’s comments on the subject of Heilpraktikers are not complimentary.

Orac basks in the adoration of Gary Null
Calm down Orac. It is a great honour but it is not the Nobel Prize.

One does hear of some strange things when reading Adams. There really is something called the “Association for Comprehensive Energy Psychology”? Which seems to advocate “Emotional Freedom Techniques”? Gwyneth Paltrow must be envious at a missed marketing opportunity.

Oh, and just a note on the accuracy of Null’s sources, he mentions ” professional journals, including the American Psychological Association”. There is no such journal. And then he mentions the “Canadian Broadcast Company” which does not show up when I google it.

There is a popular psychological journal “American Psychologist” and there is the “Canadian Broadcasting Corporation”. Close but no cigar. Or bloody careless incompetence.

Or, if your tongue gets tangled, the Canadian Broadcorping Castration, as it was once infamously called.

The “Null’ Hypothesis (i.e., Gary Null hypothesis or GH0) is a stylistic attempt to affirm the homeopathic affect.

@ Orac,

Image Alert:

Gary Null is the only person wearing sunglasses in the photograph at the beginning of your post.

Is Gary Null a celebrity, sick, or shy?

His future’s so bright, he’s gotta wear shades? I don’t think so.
BTW, it looks like he’s still rocking the crappy hair dye. You’re fooling no one,Gary.

Well, according to Wikipedia, Gary was born in 1945; so he’s 72 or 73 years old. That’s about what I guessed looking at the screen cap from one of his videos that I used for this post.


I wondered about the hair dye because alties so fear the chemikalz in Revlon or L’Oreal:
I found in an upstate health food store….
Natural hair dyes – shades like “Burnt Ashes” or “Coal Miner”:, maybe?
He also makes his own line of rejuvenating hair and skin care.

I hereby rest my case.

Natural hair dyes – shades like “Burnt Ashes” or “Coal Miner”:, maybe?

The local health-food store used to have at least eight different shades of henna. I could maybe use a touch of reddishness, now that I think about it, but it’s an awfully messy affair.

Clearly Null missed an opportunity to pick up used scientific equipment to project the concept of a lab from which to push all manner of anti-science lunacy. Adams has Null beat by a mile in pseudo everything. Null SHOULD be jealous of Adams, not Orac.

Commenting on one’s appearance isn’t my thing although that photo of Null is concerning. He does not look well at all. Given that he hardly appears to be the picture of health, his critique of SBM falls quite flat.

Commenting on Null’s appearance is fair game in my opinion, since his acolytes go on about how great he looks for his age. And hair dye on a senior man is always good for an obligatory cheap shot.

I wasn’t even thinking about his bad hair dye. He looks skeletal and well, just unwell. Even at his age, quite ironic given his chosen profession.

“Skeptic leaders such as Wales, Novella and Gorski…cling to their perceptions of intellectual superiority.”

Such perceptions take root easily and are justifiable, given the nonsense perpetuated by Null and similar folks, who lack basic critical thinking skills.

Why is Null on a rampage against Wikipedia? Aren’t his glorious writings and the output of alt-wikis like the one Adams started enough to [del]fool[/del] educate the populace?

Orac has arrived!

As I’ve mentioned previously, this isn’t the first time Null and Gale** have written about or discussed him, usually omitting his name when broadcasting perhaps to shield listeners from his brilliance.

When he reads articles aloud, he pads them with self-congratulatory poppycock- like his storied background as a professor, researcher, philanthropist, investigative journalist, inventor, art expert and activist .

Interestingly, when I checked today, there was no link to either piece

HOWEVER the letter to Wikip– is still there. And I assume tapings of the two shows where he read them on air- Monday and Tuesday.
I was very happy to find that the Wikip- bio has had an effect on his woo-slinging: the lawyer who wrote to them states that since the bio was up, Null hasn’t received invites to conferences and that it affects sales.

(He is especially irate about how his education is portrayed: basically, Dr Barrett looked into the degrees he attained in nutrition at Thomas Edison and Union. Edison is an avenue for people who studied outside of traditional universities, say in armed services or industry ( which he didn’t) – to get degrees via self-study and Union is a correspondence school which was not authorised to hand out doctorates in sciences and has since been re-structured.
Lee also discussed these bogus degrees and was sued. Null sued Wikip– for 100 million USD- both suits tossed: this fact used to be at Quackwatch Credential watch)

PERSONALLY, I feel rewarded that slogging through this dead marsh of intellectual detritus FOR YEARS has yielded results. I note what I hear to alert sceptics to both material and methods of brainwashing that woo-meisters use to pad their wallets. I feel uniquely qualified because of my own formal education and life experience : it makes me sick that frauds and poseurs like Null seek to “educate” an unsuspecting public as well as posing as health professionals- even through pretense in the liberal arts won’t kill anyone.

AND although I’ve never been mentioned by name, I think that Null and Gale are aware of my activities- they once discussed a woman who was “poisoning his reputation on the internet”- probably an admirer whom he discarded.
No I only met the loon once at a bookstore event. He looks worse in person. NO way.

** Richard Gale is his producer/ enabler who has a better command of language- I’ve heard him and imagine that most of the writing is his. He is prn’s “resident scholar” and has an MA in Bio or similar, worked in Pharma.
BUT STILL: Wake Forest?

Part of Null’s recent crusades involve disparaging university education for youngsters:
with very few exceptions (ONLY if needed for a license), they should pursue trades and attend vocational schools.

Leave the esoteric philosophy courses and critical thinking labs to him. His “classrooms on the air”.

Althought I’m starting out a vocational trade course (machining technics, I’ll get to learn how to use such machines: and ), the last person who suggested me to learn a vocational trade and forego higher education such as university level education got the verbal equivalent of a bowel resection using a rusty scalpel without any anesthetics.


What on earth is the second one? The lathe I can sort of imagine in practice,but the other is a psychic mystery to me.

A mill (well, machining center).

A lathe is used to turn the piece which make round pieces but a mill turn a cutter (circular cutter) making flat planes on a given surface (piece of metal for the most part although I did turn and mill wood close to 20 years ago when I took that same course).

There exist some machine able to do both turning and milling to make hex pieces and more esoteric ones ( but they are…complicated to use (not a big deal to me) and pricey (not a big deal as long as I don’t have to pay for such machines).


Thank you oh Leader of Critical thinking! I will send you your cut of the millions that I receive monthly, It will be in the normal place, under the moss-covered stone.

I’ve not heard of Gary Null, not sure why I haven’t but now he is on my radar. Thanks Gary!

A few corrections, Gary’s info is a bit out of date, no kidding.

I live in Monterey County, CA not Monterrey, Mexico. I do not run a small photo studio, I am retired from the studio photography business, and I didn’t own anything. All this is clearly written on the Susan Gerbic Wikipedia page, so don’t know how he missed that.

The World Wikipedia project was 2012-2014 and merged into GSoW. We aim to improve all Wikipedia pages concerning science, scientific skepticism and the paranormal and do it in all languages possible. And we do. Keep an eye on our website, we “brag/announce” all the work we do that is a significant change.

Yes, we did receive a grant from the JREF in December 2017, we were the only group to receive an award. They did issue a grant in 2016, but the organization receiving it did not want any announcement. That grant allowed us to become About Time which is a non-profit (paperwork almost done) and we can now receive donations with will allow GSoW to continue its mission, which is …

The mission of About Time is to find, mentor and train people to educate and promote science and scientific skepticism through crowd-sourced and educational activities world-wide. This is done through conference attendance, lectures, videos, podcasts, and interaction on social media & in person. Attending skeptical workshops, and participating in hands-on as well as online instruction are all encouraged.

About Time also runs my local skeptic group Monterey County Skeptics, which is just mainly to help cover costs associated with our yearly (January) SkeptiCamp (come hang out with us, the weather is amazing here)

About Time is also hoping to hand out conference scholarships to trained GSoW members starting in 2019. And About Time also helps fun the various work I manage concerning pseudoscience, mainly focusing on grief vampires and now we are looking to Facilitated Communication and its ugly cousin Rapid Prompting Method. Stay Tuned.

Here is our website, it has all the information Gary Null or anyone should want.

I also wanted to point out that one of Null’s complaints about Orac is that he is a genius with Google search optimization tools. (which I had that special power) but what Null is saying is partly true. Because David Gorski (and many of the other SBM peeps) are notable by Wikipedia standards (that means they have Wikipedia pages) then when they write something for SBM it can be used as a citation on a Wikipedia page.

GSoW is very aware of this and often uses SBM articles as citations on pages. Sometimes we even ask for SBM to write an article so it can be used on Wikipedia pages that lack the scientific point of view.

i lecture on GSoW at least 10 times a year, and part of my presentation explains this and how powerful it is.

A recent example is the Wikipedia page for the documentary “What the Health?” it was brand new and no notable science-focused folks had written/spoken about the movie which was airing on Netflix. We wrote to Harriet Hall who “took one for the team” and gave us a great article about the non-science of “What the Health?” and now it resides on the Wikipedia page, which since we rewrote the page has been viewed … 475,116 times in English, and 9,006 times to the Polish page we also wrote. That’s some chickens!

GSoW has many examples of this as we have just added our 602nd page this morning. We work on all kinds of topics, biographies of scientists, vaccine related articles, creationist related, climate change related, UFO, psychics, $cientology, Alt-Med topics, humanist topics all kinds of things.

We keep track of all the pageviews to those 602 pages we have completely written or rewritten (no stubs allowed) and I just checked our numbers… about 34K a day, 1,128,981 pageviews in the last 30 days. In total we are up to 25,772,834 pageviews. Nothing to sneeze at, so people like Gary Null and friends should be afraid. We are spreading the work of SBM and friends all over one of the most used websites in the world. We won’t change the minds of the cranks, we are aiming at the average person who is just looking for some information. Maybe a co-worker mentioned homeopathy, or a school friend thinks people can spontaneously combust (A page GSoW rewrote in 2013 that has 1,873,978 pageviews already)

If you would like to become GSoW we do all the training from the very beginning, you must be on Facebook where we keep our Secret Cabal (I’m not kidding) and you will be part of an amazing team. Most of us will never have the amazing voice and reach of Orac, but we CAN help spread his voice further. Join us!

sgerbic writes,

Most of us will never have the amazing voice and reach of Orac, but we CAN help spread his voice further.

MJD says,

Orac’s not-so-respectful insolence is a game changer for sure.

A bit off topic,

Went to Walmart today and noticed that all the baby bottle nipples and pacifiers were made of silicone.

Thank you Walmart!

Simply because SBM physicians may not understand biophysics, quantum energy, and physical properties of water should not close the door on homeopathy as mere quackery.

And if a biophysicist closes the door on homeopathy as quackery…? Is it just me or is he making an inverse argument by authority there? An argument by not authority…

Surely Skeptics will embrace the value of nanotechnology without understanding the physics of spatial quantum confinement behind it. Nanomedince is rapidly becoming part of conventional medicine’s drug arsenals. Safety studies for nano-drugs are weak at best. Yet there are analogous features to nanotechnology and homeopathic theory in terms of spatial physics and force.

Why do they never face that their “science” is just wrong? Somebody understands the quantum mechanics. Pulling out quantum language is not pulling rank. Why in the world does he have to keep specifying the adjective “spatial” with physics? Nobody actually in the field ever talks like that. “Spatial” physics? He must love the position operator… does this mean he can’t take it when quantum mechanics digresses into abstract representations or dips into Hilbert spaces, which are not necessarily “spatial” at all? Further, nanotechnology is not solely about quantum confinement: in a quantum dot maybe, but in nanomachines like motor proteins, it’s about biased statistical behavior and entropy. As if the “skeptical community” categorically doesn’t include people who know about these things.

As a quick follow up; nanomedicine at the moment is often about combining pharmacology with nanoparticles. There is a lot of behavior there that has nothing to do with quantum confinement at all. I suppose Null would be surprised to know that the “nano” size scale is actually bigger than the one for “conventional” chemical medicines and therefore actually less quantum mechanical…

You do not need to have a detailed understanding of biophysics, quantum energy, or the physical properties of water to conclude that homeopathy is quackery. As I have said before, all you need is a high school level knowledge of chemistry. The key number is Avogadro’s number, about 6 * 10^23. That’s what tells you that any dilution beyond 12C will result in something statistically indistinguishable from the distilled water you are using to make the dilution, and in particular that any such preparation is statistically unlikely to contain any of the alleged active ingredient. Many homeopathic remedies go well beyond 12C in dilution.

Or as I believe I once saw, “For a good time call Avogadro

You don’t even need to understand chemistry. You just need to understand basic exponent reading and comparisons to giant bathtubs. Chemistry is a nice bonus. And you can also talk about the patently silly idea about “water memory” and how every dust particle in a water droplet mysteriously isn’t supercharged. I strongly believe you can explain how ridiculous homeopathy is to a child.

One additional thing I thought to write this morning, but didn’t have the time…

I think that modern homeopaths know that they can’t get around Avagardo’s number. This has been the de facto skeptic attack on homeopathy for a long time now. You can even see it in the Homeopath Orac spoke about last week… this woman treating the child with diluted rabies virus. They know there’s nothing left after dilution and the canny ones even admit it.

I think they’re trying to use quantum mechanics in an effort to trump Avagadro’s number –which is especially useful since they usually assume that no one is qualified to pick apart quantum crap. “If your woo has problems based on classical physics, graduate to a quantum physics explanation in order to escape all limits!” This is where all the “water memory” BS comes from. Dabble in a little Entanglement and a lot of Uncertainty principle and water carries a memory miasma of whatever you originally started with. The trick with killing quantum crankery is, in my opinion, attacking with Planck’s constant (6.63E-34 J*s), a constant even further out than Avogadro’s number, to show that quantum effects are as tightly regulated as any other physics and that quantum weirdness is not an escape that permits homeopathy. Avogadro’s number is the well known attack on Homeopathy… we need to spread around Planck’s constant a bit to shore up defense against Dr. Emoto’s water garbage. (Was it Orac who said “If water has a memory, shouldn’t we care about all the sh!t it touches?” or was that James Randi?)

Oh, hey, congrats, man. I’ve been behind the 8-ball since Thanksgiving and never followed up.

Was it Orac who said “If water has a memory, shouldn’t we care about all the sh!t it touches?” or was that James Randi?

I believe it was actually Tim Minchin in his poem “Storm”.

Yah, something tells me that “quantum energy” doesn’t mean what the Nullard thinks it does. G-d save us all from G—ling “energy in quantum physics” (without quotes); tell everybody about mass shells, Gary.

If so, I have to leave the assignment to Denice’s stronger sruff.

@ foolish physicist:

Null pretends that he is an expert in science, history and the arts so of course he has to drop terminology to impress listeners who have even less of an education than he.

Over the years, I’ve listed some of his biggest goof ups:
as an expert in life sciences, he struggled with the words, amygdala and serotonin
he discussed the great Italian artist, “TITAN”
he narrates how the Hamilton/ Burr duel occurred near his home in WV**
he uses the phrase “body politic” inappropriately frequently
he talks about “cognition” about as often as he does “quantum”
“short term memory” as if meant a few years ago

So he isn’t only f@cking with physics but physiology, psychology, art, history
In short, hilarity reigns @ prn,fm

** there is something nearby associated with Burr

he discussed the great Italian artist, “TITAN”

I know him! He painted really BIG pictures.

Sheesh. It’s really sad to me that he has an audience. We definitely need people willing to take the time to patrol wikipedia (and other online venues) to simply make the effort to preserve veracity. Representative democracy can’t survive without at least something of a properly educated electorate.

Has Null been extirpated from all the Pacifica outlets? I see that he sued in 2016.

Clearly, Orac’s expose of Null and Gale’s expose hit a nerve:
the recordings of Monday’s and Tuesday’s shows wherein Parts I and II were read aloud are NO LONGER at!

They understand the internet little. They understand little in general.

See my latest comment. I saved the MP3 files and have provided the direct links to the audio hosted on Podbean.

Amusingly, Null appears to have taken down the links on his website leading to the audio and transcripts for his episodes of 4/30/2018 and 5/1/2018. However, he didn’t delete the Podbean links to the audio. Here’s the link for part one:

Here’s the link for part two:

Oddly enough, the direct links to the PDFs still work, at least for now. I, of course, have saved the MP3 files of the audio, as well as the PDF files of the partial transcripts. Sorry, Gary, but the Internet never forgets, although I wish I could. Listening to your soporific voice almost made me fall asleep at my desk. How on earth is it that you have a radio show/podcast and that people actually listen to it?

Maybe Gary actually has a sense of shame, given the number of gross errors of fact in his “investigation” and how out of date much of his information is, even more so than I thought given the new information provided by Susan Gerbic above. In any case, if Null gets rid of the links to the transcripts, I will simply do some more discussion, allowing me to quote more of the idiocy there. As I said, I have the PDFs. I have the audio. I’ve told the Wayback Machine to archive the links to the PDFs.

Maybe he had to fix the labels he had for “April 30 and April 31” HILARIOUS!
I swear I’m not making this up..

As for framing medical research favoring conventional medicine as “unwavering facts,”

As Stephen Colbert would say, facts have a well-known pro-SBM bias.

I was struck by the repeated mentions of atheism; thinking about them, I had a revelation.
Religions are a lot like homeopathy. They may start out with kernels of fact and truth, but ultimately they become so diluted that it’s almost impossible to find them.
Also, like homeopathy, it’s at least extremely unlikely that it really does anyone any good.

@ Old Rockin’ Dave:

There definitely is a religious/ anti-atheism cast to his screeds** : Null’s mother was a medical intuitive – like Edgar Cayce- who had many clients in their native West Virginia- he claims to have inherited that ability. Often, people who attend his “health retreats” in Florida and Texas, sing his praises because he laid hands on them and Voila! – they’re healed! He has lots of testimonials about his “energy work” and “cures”.

Supposedly, he only “treats” people who are dying BUT he mentions great results with kids who have ASDs/ ADHD, people with depression, menopause, arthritis and other non-fatal conditions. I think he treats people w/o a licence.

There is so much other crap but I am not going to spill it now. I don’t know if the faux medicine or erudite posturing makes me sicker.
I have to eat and finish up some other writing.

** Adams too

Call me anal and maybe too literal, but I don’t think it’s a great comparison because homeopathy ultimately has little effect from the repeated dilutions. I think religion is more accurately characterized by corrosion, but still as effective as ever.

Cali Scrub Jay
By the scrotum follicles of Jehovah, I believe you are onto something! The religious content is diluted to zero, but then it’s administered in a tincture of politics, misogyny and hatred with a pH of 3.0. Or is it 12.0?
Makes little difference to the patient, either way.

By the scrotum follicles of Jehovah
Time to read “Chants des Maldoror” again.

I’d say 3.0 pH just to get the alkalosers off my back.

I just had a thought, about combining pH and homeopathy. If homeopathy was right, would decreasing the concentration of hydrogen ions increase the potency of the hydrogen ions and therefore make a solution MORE basic?

Resolving structure of liquid water is rather complex problem. There is one attempt:
No memory there, though.
Intel newest processor uses 14 nm rules (this is width of wires inside processor). No quantum effects yet.
There is a paper about dietary supplements and mortality:

To rehash…

-Null felt that his Wikip– bio scared off potential customers, especially the part based on Dr Barrett’s scathing review of his education and quackery

-Thus, over time, he an his cohort wrote “exposes” first about Barrett**, then Wikip— and the Sceptics including Orac ,as well as writing to Wikip- itself, reading the two parts over the air Monday and Tuesday and linking them on

-Then, Orac wrote this post

-Null’s IT squad removed both the recordings of his shows and the links to the articles and interfered with our access to them
( Orac has them safe elsewhere)

So, his followers have no access to this fabulous expose
Plus, RI has exposed even more about him.

Sometime, I may reconstruct the bio he presents to his listeners ( on air material is more grandiose) and compare it to what I know to be real
interested parties might look at Lee “Does Null have a real PhD?” for a start

** the Barrett article and the letter to Wikip– remain linked at

@ Narad:

The details are cloudy but I believe that he was tossed from Washington and Berkeley and he claims, he quit LA.
He is still on NY. He started prn when he was dumped from WBAI ( NY) because of his aids denialism and other factors. Periodically, he is off air and rants about the station that gives him free air time for his infomercials.

@ foolish physicist:

IIRC Null used to toss quantum willy nilly into his woo to explain spirit and healing but I’ve never seen a book fortunately.

HOWEVER he pretends to know physics as well as physiology and philosophy whilst assembling his cargo cult.

AS I mentioned previously, what he presents in written, filmed or taped form is tamer than on-air material: he has help. His recorded shows are often scrubbed as well.

You have to remember that his followers listen over time – as I have- and get the whole rotten picture. Learning proceeds from repetition, frequency and intensity amongst other factors.

His greatest con is his self portrayal : how brilliant he is and how he saves people altruistically.
If listeners who aren’t already enraptured learn how abysmal his “learning” is, they might question his woo .

Seriously, if you have a PhD, you shouldn’t stumble over pronunciations of Spanish, French or German: see Mozart, el Nino, Camus, Titan ( sic) etc etc.



I took a peek at prn and the shows about Wikip– I & II are reinstated: I guess Orac shamed him. But the articles are not. A quick scan of the second led me to surmise that it may have been doctored ( although the hoary old woo-meister is not a doctor- of any sort).
I didn’t want to listen in detail: even I have limits.

In addition:

Wikip– Part I is up in
I haven’t checked to see if it has been cleaned up.

I suppose they think that sceptics will move on or not see changes.
AS if, wankers!

Now the second written part is up as well.
I haven’t really scanned either one well but I suspect that they’ll be watered down,

Continuing along this sorry track..

I listened to Thursday’s show tape and ORAC has REALLY struck a nerve:
the middle portion of the sad mess was a rant against “authoritarian” SBM and defence of the loon’s so-called PhD.
Oh boy! Maybe an half or more’s worth.
SBM people were “screaming” on the internet, said he.

I think it’s very nice of him to let his listeners know about the existence of SBM. Perhaps some will take a peek and see the light.

@ rs:

You are correct. I expect he will have to do damage control for quite a while. Good.

-btw- I deserve a medal for my work this week. A virtual one will suffice.

To FiNALLY sum up on this malignant imbroglio of deceitfulness:

I looked over prn’s activities in the days since Orac wrote this article- here’s what I found:
– they re-posted all written and spoken material of April 30 and May 1 which were removed
– from my brief scans, it seems that some material has been removed- I see less of Orac’s real name although it is not totally absent. Less about other SBM writers except Dr SN. I think “Wake Forest” is gone as well. Heh.
-the broadcasts that followed on the 2nd, 3rd and 4th each contain a midsection rife with justification and braggadocio detailing Nulls’ incredible achievements / doctorate/ career : 20-30 minutes worth each.**
-in these rants, SBM is vilified as a cult, an inquisition, McCarthyism, Pharma-fuelled and what not
– the audience is promised continued reportage about Homeopathic and other therapies that work and enrage SBM

** he is pissed at Dr DG.

I hope Null and his Nullites continue to tackle the tough issues that SBMers don’t want us to know about, like the health hazards of smart meters. A Harvard-trained doc is sounding the alarm:

Null has recognized the risks, reading an article titled “7 Reasons To Never Use Smart Meters” on his show back in June, 2016, but the article seems to have mysteriously disappeared from the archives, and I bet you can figure out who was responsible. The same show featured Gary discussing when he worked at Drexel University and authored studies about making sure people were eating high vibrational food. Can’t find that reference either. 🙁

Mercola is all over the smart meter holocaust, naturally.

Dr. Donohue, the Harvard-trained MD warning about what smart meters do to our health, is based at SUNY-Albany. He is also co-editor in chief of my new go-to journal Environmental Pollution, which has contributed a groundbreaking article linking male infertility to bedroom noise:,-study-suggests

The finding that ambient noise above the level of an average suburban street lowers sperm counts, helps explain why large noisy cities are so empty of people. The implications are scary – what vaccines don’t accomplish in terms of depopulation, car horns and people yakking on cellphones will (eek!).

Null has recognized the risks, reading an article titled “7 Reasons To Never Use Smart Meters” on his show back in June, 2016

Isn’t this generally up to the utility provider, which, y’know, owns the equipment?

@ Dangerous Bacon:

Drexel? I never heard THAT one.

He claims that he’s been a PROFESSOR for over 30 ( or 40) YEARS. He teaches GRADUATE students. He then mentions several NY area schools/ universities – including a well-known art institute, Pratt. Similarly , he’s a tenured research fellow at the Institute of Applied Biology for a similar period. Our friend, c0nc0rdance couldn’t find any references to that place except for Null’s bio.

But then he drops that he got rid of his old South Beach condo and bought an estate in Naples where he spends several months a year for more than 20 years : one of the sites of his infamous health retreats and intensive training for races.

The question is: how can you spend winters ( Nov- April) in FLORIDA for 30 years and still manage to work in NY ( and Philly) for the SCHOOL year?
That must be some REALLY expensive commuting.
All that flying is not a good choice for people who want to stop global warming as he does.

In Corvallis you can opt out of the smart meter program for a one-time $306 fee and a charge of $36 a month, which would seemingly discourage any but the most determined “environmental pollution” advocates.

“…there are those who believe smart meters create issues with their sleep patterns; increase their stress and anxiety levels; and cause them to experience headaches, ringing in their ears and even cardiac symptoms.

The allegations have not been confirmed scientifically.”

Anecdote Alert: I just got a smart meter and the impact on my life is that it rebooted everything in my house so I got to discover (again) how many clocks I have. Nothing else.

Then again I live in a city so there are lines everywhere: power, cable, telephone, and bus lines. Another device is hardly going to have a measurable impact.

I had not realized that “high vibrational food” as promoted by Gary Null was an actual thing, but it appears to be yet another plank used to construct the Potemkin Village of Woo, as described in this article:

Note that all herbs are considered to be “high vibrational”, including the ones capable of vibrating your liver and kidneys into failure. “High vibrational” turns out to be a reiteration of “natural is good”.

The author of that article on food seems to have won an award. I suppose that is the cows manure award.

She seems to think only GMO food is geneticly altered, But geneticly altering food has started with growing crops and selecting and crossbreeding the plants that delevered the most food.

I think that it’s important that sceptics publicise how woo-meisters present utterly bizarre nonsense like this:

they may first display some reasonable material:
eat healthy food, watch fats and sugar, limit processed foods, get exercise – which are supported by research.

But then, they descend into :
meat, dairy and wheat are POISONS, GMOs cause cancer, certain foods are higher frequency, raw vegetables are LIVING.

Followers may take the second group of statements as seriously as the first.

Of course, they con people by mis-representing their credentials and maligning SBM.

By going into detail about how information is disseminated at sites like prn, I hope to give readers insight into the methods charlatans use to mislead their audiences.
– they give different messages to different audiences ( as soon as they knew sceptics were reading, they changed material)
– they claim to be supported by research when it is often made-up, mis-quoted or un-related
– they claim personal expertise and support by experts
– they present false biographical information/ personal experiences that are never verified
– they use media like radio/ video to make wild claims which may later be scrubbed ( but which the audience heard)
– they make sure that regular listeners’ positive reactions to them are reinforced frequently .

As the poet said:

“Oh what a tangled web we weave….”

“But then, they descend into :…raw vegetables are LIVING.”

My local supermarkets do this all the time, by selling a head of lettuce with a nubbin of roots in a plastic container and proclaiming it “living”,

If roots on greenery are prerequisites for being considered alive, how come I can take a sprig of mint from a garnished item served at a restaurant, place it in moist soil and raise a plant from it?*

*yes, I’ve actually done this.

But that proves raw food is living, otherwise you couldn’t raise a plant from it.

The association this raises for me is the description in Terry Pratchett’s Small Gods of the “live” yogurt, I.e. Crawling with flies and bugs.

They should hope most of their clients are not Pratchett readers.

Along these lines: Null regales his audience with tales of how food is contaminated-

he would read from the Jungle as if the meat processing being described WAS RECENT ( never mind that it led to reform).
Milk is called “basically pus” from sick cows laced with anti-biotics (pronounced anti BEE otics)
and maybe the best of all:
when doing his “research at the institute” he asked observers ( people came at night to watch him experiment on rats which he let run free, do healing by prayer and psi research) to bring expensive food to be looked at under the microscope, so a guy brought SUSHI from a place that charged 100s of dollars** ( never mind that this was decades ago when nothing costs that much and sushi was a rarity) AND
it was crawling with worms, too tiny to see with the naked eye but there.

Of course, none of this is documented or photographed but the stories are told many times usually elaborated.

** was this a vision of the future? Watch it, Nobu.

I have seen pictures of fish with worms in it (as part of an explanation of which fish you shouldn’t eat as sushi), but that was in a book by Nathan Myhrvold, who may be a patent troll, but he’d eat Null for lunch. (Those worms were big enough to see with the naked eye.)

Oh crap! More crap!

Null’s expose isn’t done yet.
today he presents another white paper about homeopathy, deriding SBM for opposing it.

Wikip– is a “formidable” and “dishonest” force against homeopathy. Who are these editors and who are their “gurus basking in reductionism”? **
Sceptics call it “water”. Dr Novella calls it “pre-scientific, magical thinking”. He quotes Dr DG: “It’s quite literally nothing”.

If he asked the “average sceptic” about vitamin C – they know little about it***; there are over 25000 studies about vitamin C ?
“This Is REAL science – evidence based science”.

( paraphrases)
…..Patients are disillusioned by SBM: they turn to woo. People realise they must be responsible for the own health.
Lots of homeopathy in India, even treating cancer, like gliomas.
Banerjee treats many patients free, studied by MD Anderson, used in over 80 countries- film, “Magic Pills” ( the director was on his show yesterday)


more woo about his search for cancer survivors from alties like Issels, Burton et al.
what Banerjee has done is like “Bannister breaking the 4 minute mile”
Also British homeopathy, Tournier was on his show yesterday as well.

Sceptics and SBM present “false promises”

Homeopathy: Brazil study, Mexican study, Nepal study, Swiss ADHD
Government wastes money on SBM research

Sceptics are “paranoid and delusional” .are “victims of scientific ignorance”; they are “narcistic” ( sic)
against democracy, totalitarian; SBM is a ” deadly deception”, “ethically bankrupt”… SBM drugs kill..

People are shifting to altie BS.
More crap against sceptics.

This should be at ( taped show/ written) in the later afternoon.

** Dr WHO?
*** how can sceptics criticise if they didn’t study homeopathy/ chiropractic/ TCM/ nutrition?
is repeated throughout the expose

OK… I listened to and read today’s BS @

And it’s weak tea ( does that make it stronger? as they ARE discussing homeopathy)
Very little mention of particular sceptics by name** : just derision, mispronunciations and references to Nietzsche

I guess they know they’ll be discussed by us

Null inserts some of his predictable folk tales: he investigated alties’ cancer cures and found a high rate which he published
( not in the written form)

-btw- they label the paper “Slaying Homeopathy”

Isn’t that what sceptics do?

I’ll keep up if there are any more chapters but perhaps we put a leash on him

** Dr DG is guru numero dos

Summing up….

Over the past week, the hoary old woo-meister intermittently sputtered and hissed about sceptics and SBM, labelling them as the Deep State- the worst people in the world. Even when he was “investigating” and “‘splaining” diverse topics, he came back to US. Ha ha ha!

He promises more on these lowlifes very soon. He keeps on about Wikip— thus, I imagine that that bio has really hit home, i.e. affected profits: he especially rants about millennials who “never read” , have abysmal educations AND who rely upon the internet ESPECIALLY Wikip–. He wants to lead decent, intelligent people away from this “fake news” and towards his own tripe.

I absolutely LOVE IT when he or Adams carry on about the horrendous current state of education.
It is to laugh.

You’re really trying to goad me into responding again, aren’t you? To be honest, I’m thinking that something might need to be said on my not-so-super-secret other blog, but I’ll contemplate over the weekend.

BTW, what’s with today’s post? No comments? It wasn’t that bad, was it? Or, worse, that uninteresting?

@ Orac:

Not at all, Mister.

I though that you SHOULD know that he’s been continuing and promises MORE ( of the same) for over a week
Sceptics got under his ( very thin**) skin.

I imagine that he and Gale will keep it up because listeners must be going to Wikip—.

NOTE that he never says anything about RI ( altho’ Gale has) because it is more accessible and is probably a bigger threat if his followers found it. Also he drops Orac’s real name as well as his ‘nym.

I actually hope that they shut up for a while because monitoring this shit since the 30th was exhausting.

Today’s post was fine. I commented under the other stem cell one not being sure which one was a better fit,

** not just metaphorically
Yeah, I know, I’m mean.


For me, your posts are always interesting but as someone somewhere said: life is what happen when one makes plans. I wake up every weekday morning at 4:30 and commute an hour and a quarter to go to school at 7am (classes are at 7:30) and then get back home exactly 12 hours after having woken up (i.e. 4:30pm time of arrival).

That makes for abysmally short evenings.


p.s. Good morning btw.

The saga continues…

-The wicked powers-that-be at Wikip– have restored Null’s bio to one more amenable to sceptics, i.e. as it was prior to woo-bent intervention
( thus, no self-aggrandising recitatives concerning his books, films, awards and accomplishments).

-SBM has a new terrific post concerning Null and Gale’s attacks on Wikip–, sceptics and all things reasonable. Happily, the author chooses unflattering images of the woo-meister : focusing on appearances is entirely appropriate in this case because he constantly mentions how his audience tells him he hasn’t aged in 30 years due to veganism and clean living.

-btw- he is sputtering as I speak about Wikip—, SBM and healing.
More to come tomorrow or Wednesday.

I am pleased to contribute whatever I can to further our cause although my ( various) overlords do not pay me enough,

Today, the shriveled old woo-meister continues upon his hobby horse about the evilz of Wikip—, sceptics and quackbusters
(, his show about 15 minutes in- 19 minutes), outlining his grand plan:
over the next year, he’ll present research that illustrates how wrong the evil aforesaids are about plant based therapies, other woo and woo-meisters forever smeared by Wales et al. There are over 100K studies to prove the efficacy of herbs etc.

You see, many alt med experts who have had their reputations and livelihoods RUINED by Wikip— / sceptics/ quackbusters do not have an outlet to address these grievous wrongs as he does so he will gallantly work on their behalves as well as his own.

So I assume Orac et compagnie are truly pissing him off. It must be affecting business,
In other words, we bad.

The fol de rol continues.. features a new screed concerning Wikip– and Botanicals : I fully expect the chief woo-meister to read it aloud at noon inserting his own self-aggrandisement and commentary as per usual. ” In my OWN research at the Institute, I found…”

Basically it claims efficacy for plant based medicines/ supplements that Wikip– scoffs at ( curcumin, resveratrol etc) .
Null and Gale include comments by Dr Crislip about Jefferson and the latter’s responses.

How can sceptics/ physicians criticise woo if they never studied it? I’ll bet Drs DG, Novella, Crislip and Hall never had courses in
Chinese medicine, Ayurveda or shamanry. Not one.

The real question is how many effective books, documentaries and protocols have you created and how many people have you cured vs. Gary Null? It’s a shame how quickly people are to talk nonsense without knowing the facts. Being a conventional doctor today has lost its value especially when the books have been rewritten by the pharmaceutical companies. Sorry guys, this isn’t the 80’s anymore and the information you guys had in Med school “back in the day” is readily available at our fingertips. Gary’s work is backed by proven science and just like the rest of us humans we are not perfect so it’s a bit annoying watching people nitpick at every little mistake. It seems like most people here are stubborn so the only question you really need to ask yourself is how many people have you actually cured versus Gary?

The blogger has been published several times in PubMed indexed journals. You really are bad at this?


how many effective books, documentaries and protocols have you created

How do you define an “effective books” or “effective documentar[ies”?

How do either those relate to real people, who may or may not suffer from a condition they want “cured”?

May I officially wish for either a preview function or a comment copy editor? On the screen it always looks like it’s correct . . .

I think the author of this article has cured more people with cancer than Gary Null and all other quacks combined.
Finding out who the author is, is not that hard.

It is the worst kept secret on teh internets. We are coy about answering because finding out is a form of an intelligence test.

It looks like you failed that test.

@ Clinton:

Gary Null can SAY that he’s cured thousands of people but he has never documented this other than by:
– by saying that he has
– writing up “heath support” groups which includes poor methodology in unreliable journals assisted by colleagues
– using testimonials by people who attended his retreats and interacted closely with him
– relying on his associates and supporters to report on his success

Furthermore, he uses protocols that HAVE been tested by real scientists and don’t work, like megadoses of vitamin C, green juices, vegan diets et al for SERIOUS medical conditions like cancer, hiv/aids, Alzheimer’s, MS and others. Many of his ideas are old natural health concepts from decades ago.

I’ve listened to him for years and his resume has grown by leaps and bounds about being a researcher, professor, therapist, humanitarian, journalist, filmmaker etc.
He says he’s counselled huge numbers of people. He’s spent thousands of hours each researching vaccines, cancer, etc. He’s gone around the world observing healthy lifestyles. His athletic accomplishments are legendary.

He’s an expert in everything: health, medicine, biochemistry, psychology, political science, economics, philosophy, history, art. YET if you’ve really studied any of these subjects in an actual UNIVERSITY you would know that his knowledge base is pathetic, he mixes up ideas, misquotes, mispronounces fundamental terms and gets simple things wrong. He sounds impressive to only someone who knows even less than he does.

AND that’s exactly the point: he wants to get people to admire him and follow his advice which usually involves buying his products. Since the diet he promotes ( vegan, organic, non GMO, kosher, non-gluten) is nearly impossible to maintain, followers can always supplement it with his many powdered formulae.

He’s a salesman making infomercials on a daily basis.

Facts speak louder than your opinion and meanwhile Orac practices conventional medicine, I’d like to know what his success rate is, especially 5 years after a patient has been treated. And I get it, natural medicine is a major threat to your pockets but at the end of the day Gary Null may treat less patients, however he produces better results with a higher success rate. And that is a fact! Another fact is that Gary Null does not charge his patients and treats everyone free of charge. Therefore the interest is in a cure and not your bank account. Everyone is quick to refute without an open debate or facts to back their argument instead of working together collectively to repair a failed system. I’m not here to be perfect or proofread every pixel on this article but what I do know is that the medical industrial complex is very flawed and thanks to technology people like myself can spend many years researching the facts instead of relying on a doctor that cashes in on ignorance.

Okay, go post some facts. Just post the PubMed indexed papers that Null has published.


Are Medical Hypotheses, Townsend’s Letter, Orthomolecular Journal and Penthouse listed in PubMed?

Unfortunately Medical Hypotheses is, it is not peer reviewed.. Asking for PubMed indexed papers is not perfect.

Pretty much sure Penthouse is not.

I’s gots mah medical dugree from Google Universitah!

Dude, unless you actually work in the field and do real research with patients, you are not a researcher. No one who works in this field says Big Pharm is all unicorns and rainbows. That the hospital system of today is all unicorns and rainbows. It’s not.

According to the American Cancer Society, the 5 year survival rate for breast cancer is 90%, assuming the cancer is found when it is still in the breast. If it has metastisized, the 5 year survival rate is 27%. Those numbers don’t include staging. Long term survival is longer when cancer is Stage IA or IB than when it is Stage 4, and they don’t account for cancer that recurs.

Still, that’s a lot better than it used to be when breast cancer was pretty much a death sentence.

Gary Null has no statistics. He only has claims and testimonials. You can’t go back to his patients five years later and see how they’re doing; often they are dead because they didn’t get conventional care. This is a story Orac blogs about frequently, sadly.

So you can’t claim that Null has better stats because he doesn’t actually have any data at all.

I echo Chris: link to the PubMed indexed papers that show Null has actually cured anyone.

Truthfully, Panacea, should we even call his followers patients? He’s not a doctor or therapist. He MAY be licensed as a nutritionist or dietician- THAT’S IT! Serious illness is not treated with diet.

He CLAIMS that he only counsels the terminally ill but then brags how he helps people with many non-terminal conditions like depression, arthritis, kids with ADHD or ASD.
RIGHT, he even suggests protocols to children.

ANYONE can say what he does:
I can say I’ve treated thousands of people and cured everyone who listened to me – whilst all the scoffers died horrible deaths ( as he says)
BUT I won’t because I don’t misrepresent myself and claims are nothing WITHOUT DATA presented properly so others can verify and/ or replicate.

He and others like Adams hate Wikipedia because they look at data.


natural medicine is a major threat to your pockets

No, it really isn’t. If what you call “natural ” medicine worked as well as you imagine, no one would have bothered to invent all this other stuff – e.g., chemo and radiation therapy, antivirals. It’s because those methods weren’t working we looked for something more effective.

Just curiousm(and not entirely off topic): what books did you read/have read to you as a child?


Another fact is that Gary Null does not charge his patients and treats everyone free of charge.

Citation needed.

Um, if the Nullard is “treating patients,” he’s practicing medicine without a license. Well played.

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